A Look at the Ravens 2012 Salary Cap
by Fandemonium on Jan 31, 2012 9:27 AM EST
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PrintHere’s a look at the Baltimore Ravens Salary Cap for 2012. Unfortunately I don’t know how to insert a table or I would give you the current salaries of each player under contract. I have pulled this salary information from several sources, so while I can’t be sure it is exactly accurate, I think it is pretty darn close.
2011 Roster: My list includes 53 players who were under contract with the Ravens in 2011 with a total Salary Cap number of $119,781,963. The cap number for 2011 was $120M.
2012 Roster: The Salary Cap for 2012 has not yet been set, but the rumor is that it will not change substantially from 2011, so we’ll work with a $125M Salary Cap for now in trying to set the roster.
The Ravens have 32 players under contract for 2012 with a Cap Number of $105,071,286. This includes Dominique Foxworth’s cap number of $8.3M. Assuming Foxworth gets released (a pretty fair assumption), you lose his salary but take a onetime hit for his remaining bonus money of $2.7M, therefore the savings is $5.6M. So we start with 31 players at $99,471,286.
The Ravens have 4 Restricted Free Agents (LB Dannell Ellerbe, RB Matt Lawrence, CB Lardarius Webb, CB Cary Williams). For RFA’s, the Ravens have the chance to offer them a tender, attached to a draft pick. If another team wants to sign them, we would first be able to match that offer. If we chose not to match, the other team would have to forfeit the corresponding draft pick to the Ravens in order to sign the player. Following are the Qualifying Offer amounts for 2011. Note these amounts will increase for 2012 between 5% and 10% based on the Salary Cap increase.
• Right of First Refusal and Draft Selection at Player’s Original Draft Round: one year Contract with Salary of at least $1,200,000, or 110% of the player’s prior year’s Salary, whichever is greater.
• Right of First Refusal, One Second Round Draft Selection: one year Contract with Salary of at least $1,835,000, or 110% of the player’s prior year’s Salary, whichever is greater.
• Right of First Refusal and One First Round Draft Selection: one year Contract with a Salary of at least $2,611,000, or 110% of the player’s prior year’s Salary, whichever is greater.
Given that Webb is worth more than his original 3rd round selection and Williams more than his 7th round, I see the Ravens giving Qualifying Offers to Webb (1st Round) and Williams (2nd Round). So add another $4,668,300 bringing the cap for 37 players to $106,449,586.
Now to address UFA’s in order of priority and my projections for their value.
• Ray Rice: $7.71M (Franchise Tag)
• Ben Grubbs: $4M (Yanda’s Cap in 2011)
• Andre Gurode: $3M (Birk’s Cap in 2011)
• Jarret Johnson: $3.5M (His salary in 2011 – no bonus)
• Jameel McClain: $2.5M (Just a guess)
• Cory Redding: $2.5M (His salary in 2011 – no bonus)
• Brandon McKinney: $1.4M (His salary in 2011 – no bonus)
• Brendon Ayanbadejo: $775,000 (His salary in 2011 – no bonus)
• Haruki Nakamura: $775,000 (Just a guess)
• Tom Zbikowski: $775,000 (Just a guess)
Just signing Rice, Grubbs and Gurode brings the Salary Cap to $121,159,586 for 40 players. That leaves less than $4M for the remaining 13 players, or less than $300K/player. That won’t work. At best, we retain Rice and Grubbs or Gurode. Drafting Peter Koontz sounding better to anyone?
Possible cuts: To free up Salary Cap room, here are the most likely players to be cut.
• Chris Carr: $4.25M cap number. $2.5M unpaid bonus. Net savings $1.75M.
• Ricky Williams: $2,725,000 cap number.
• Lee Evans: $4,775,000 cap number.
Tough choices, but I can see any or all three of them being cut to create cap space.
UFA Market: 2012 will be one of the largest UFA classes ever. Charley Casserly reported that nearly 25% of all NFL players will be UFA’s in 2012. Combine that with a slight increase in the Salary Cap, and you have a Buyer’s Market. So expect the Ravens to make a few cuts to free up some cap room.
The opinions posted here are those of the administrator of this blog and his loyal readers. They are in no way official comments from the team, and should not be misconstued as such, even though he thinks he could do just as well or even a better job!
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Gurode
It was a 1 year $3M deal.
"the croaking raven doth bellow for revenge."
Hamlet, William Shakespeare
Lee Evans and Ricky Williams
I don’t see us cutting them, but we may be able to restructure their contracts.
After Rice and Grubbs, I think we let everyone else test the market with the intent of resigning them. JJ, Redding, and McKinney may exceed our preferred price range, so I wouldn’t be shocked if we were unable to resign them.
Our center position is a tough one to forecast at this point, it could be addressed in multiple ways.
Evans and Ricky
Lee Evans will be in the final year of a 4 yr / $37,250,000 contract. According to one source, he may also have a $3M roster bonus due, which I did not account for. They list his 2012 cap number as $6,275,000. He would be a good candidate to restructure.
Ricky signed a 2-yr deal and don’t see him restructuring it.
"the croaking raven doth bellow for revenge."
Hamlet, William Shakespeare
by Fandemonium on Jan 30, 2012 7:58 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Hence Grubbs is gone….
You forgot something very important. I believe there is some cap hold for draft picks, not sure exactly how it works.
by Rayisyourdaddy on Feb 7, 2012 7:52 AM EST up reply actions
Grubbs: His price is going to be too high for the Ravens liking with already paying Yanda last year. Let him get paid by someone else.
Rice: Franchise tag until we can sign a long term deal.
Gurode / Birk: If Birk comes back for one more year, let Gurode walk. If not, sign Gurode to a one year deal.
JJ: I love Kruger’s potential but JJ is durable and in his prime at 30. If he’s willing to sign a deal that that his stats dictate, not his value to us, we should keep him.
McClain: He was a major leader on the field when Ray was injured. He’s a decent player that shouldn’t command a huge contract. Resign him to a long term deal.
Redding: He was awesome this year, but we have a possible great player in McPhee waiting for a full time starting role. Art Jones should be a decent role player too. Let Redding test the market and see what happens.
McKinney: Decent back up. If we can sign for vet minimum, he’s a keeper.
Ayanbadajo: He’s 35 and not a major role player. We should get younger on STs. Let him walk.
Nakurmura: Has value on STs, and in a back up role for the secondary. Resign him for a cheap contract.
Zbikowski: He has got a history of concussions and isn’t that important on STs/ Def. LEt him test the market.
Webb: Sign him to a long term deal now.
Cary: Sign him up for a couple extra years if he’s not demanding starting corner money.
Carr: Cut him.
Ricky: He’s only getting older. I think we can find someone better for the amount he’s making. Maybe Ant Allen can be the back up.
daytime commentator. night time ninja.
Grubbs: His price is going to be too high for the Ravens liking with already paying Yanda last year. Let him get paid by someone else.
Unfortunately, I agree. Sucks, when is the last time we lost a 1st round pick after his first contract was up?
Rice: Franchise tag until we can sign a long term deal.
Definitely. The tag is not very high anyway.
Gurode / Birk: If Birk comes back for one more year, let Gurode walk. If not, sign Gurode to a one year deal.
I still think we need to bring Gurode back. Quality depth is tough to come by in this league, especially at OL.
JJ: I love Kruger’s potential but JJ is durable and in his prime at 30. If he’s willing to sign a deal that that his stats dictate, not his value to us, we should keep him.
Listening to JJ this morning on 1057, he sounded like he wants to be here. He is the type of guy it seems that just wants continuity and not screw things up. His family is here, he is loved by the fans. I think he takes less money to stay here.
McClain: He was a major leader on the field when Ray was injured. He’s a decent player that shouldn’t command a huge contract. Resign him to a long term deal.
This in my opinion will be our toughest guy to keep. McClain is the guy I see stepping into Ray’s position once he retires. Really, really do not want to lose him. Ellerbe is a bum (even though I am sure jazz will tell us he sees him getting better) and BA and McClellin won’t cut it.
Redding: He was awesome this year, but we have a possible great player in McPhee waiting for a full time starting role. Art Jones should be a decent role player too. Let Redding test the market and see what happens.
He will most likely leave simply because we have crazy good depth at DL. Let McPhee put on 10-15 pounds, and there is your new 3-4 DE.
I think McKinney, Zbi, Ruki all get deals somewhere else. We will cut Foxworth, restructure Carr and keep Ricky around.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
Ellerbe is a bum (even though I am sure jazz will tell us he sees him getting better) and BA and McClellin won’t cut it.
I never really like Ellerbe all that much and always thought mcClain was the better linebacker. Ellerbe probably doesnt have it in him to to be a leader like Mccalin but he definately makes plays here and there.
I honestly feel like McCalin is the one that could step in to take over Ray Lewis spot once he retires but thats if the ravens can re-sign him
Ummm, I'm going to guess Boller?
when is the last time we lost a 1st round pick after his first contract was up
You come at the king, you best not miss.
by organizedchaos52 on Jan 31, 2012 12:50 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe I should have stated “a good first round draft pick.”
Maybe Clayton as well, right?
"Picture Me Rollin"
Boller
Signed an small extension.
Mark Clayton played five years in Baltimore and two in St. Louis. He is an FA in 2012. I am guessing at some point during his time in Baltimore he signed an extension as seven years would seem a bit out of the ordinary for a rookie WR and I believe we traded him to St. Louis, vice losing him via FA.
Not sure if we extended Travis Taylor or just let his rookie deal run out. Technically Dwan Edwards was a second round pick, but our first overall in 2004 so he was kind of like a first round pick and I know we did not extend resign him after his rookie deal.
But I believe your statement
"a good first round draft pick."
still stands…
"A little learning is a dangerous thing; Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring."
"The difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightning and a lightning bug."
"God's whiskers! Your face is as hideous as the demon's in my storybook!"
"I never expected to see the day when girls would get sunburned in the places they do today."
"It's big for a reason."
For Pittsburgh fans, that's Pope, Twain, Rostand, Rogers and Megamind
Clayton was traded.
So, I don’t think that counts.
Also, I wasn’t trying to be snide, that was an honest guess. Before him, I have no clue. Did Jamal get a second contract (I’d imagine so)?
You come at the king, you best not miss.
by organizedchaos52 on Jan 31, 2012 8:44 PM EST up reply actions
If Redding and McKinney are looking for around the same dough we need to hold on to Redding over McKinney. Not sure McPhee and Jones are ready for starting roles.
by Rayisyourdaddy on Feb 7, 2012 7:54 AM EST up reply actions
Grubbs: His price is going to be too high for the Ravens liking with already paying Yanda last year. Let him get paid by someone else.
Rice: Franchise tag until we can sign a long term deal.
I’d flip flop these 2. I think we can sign Rice to a deal that won’t kill the cap, and O line is a HUGE question mark with McKinnie and Birk well past their prime and not sure things to be back next year. I’d like to put the tag on Grubbs, because we don’t have anyone to step up and take his place and not a ton of cap space, so we’d be looking at a rookie or iffy stop gap if he walks. At least tag him this year, draft an interior lineman or 2, then if we have viable replacements, let him walk next year.
by YeahDonnie on Jan 31, 2012 4:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Agree
Grubbs is already being listed as one of the most attractive2012 FA’s, but I think the Ravens will make a competitive offer and maybe (hopefully) Grubbs wants to play in a Super Bowl more than a getting the last $ offered.
"the croaking raven doth bellow for revenge."
Hamlet, William Shakespeare
I agree. I think losing Grubbs would be devastating. Not that we can afford to lose Rice, but running backs have a hard time demanding big contracts. The last guy who wanted to blow the doors off his contract was Chris Johnson, who then badly underperformed his new deal and hurt the bargaining power of other RBs. Historically, RBs just aren’t very durable or reliable in the long term. The last big RB deal was really LDT in San Diego.
Ideal scenario is that we tag Grubbs, sign Rice.
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
jackma
The last big contract was AP, unless you left that out because it wasn’t a big enough deal. He signed a 7 year 100 million deal this offseason, then proceeded to get injured. So between that and Deangelo and CJ sucking, I think the bargaining leverage of RB’s everywhere took a major hit.
Prediction: 5 years, 38 million, 20 guaranteed.
by Rayisyourdaddy on Feb 7, 2012 7:59 AM EST up reply actions
my bad
but yes, that makes my point. still, rice wont be cheap
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
by jackmca on Feb 8, 2012 8:23 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
Grubbs is coveted by every other AFCN team, with only Cincy and Cleveland having the cash to sign him. I would love to get him in Cleveland but I dont think he’ll go there. Many teams outside of the division looking at him and they’ve got deeper pockets. it’s gonna depend if he wants the $$$ or the rings…
A bargain is something you don't need at a price you can't resist....
If I agreed with you we'd both be wrong!
My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch!
Everyone is also forgetting...
that we will more than likely be re-signing Flacco to a huge deal that will cut deeply into the cap as his rookie salary will be a lot lower than this new one plus giant bonus will be. That will definitely signal the end of the bigger name guys on the list making a lot of cash, although we could end up re-signing a few at lower salaries. Those guys and a lot of other guys in the league that will be on the market will end up taking less forthat chance to go to the Big Game.
aka 'Rexx'
Got no problem with that. There is NO better option out there for us than Flacco, and he is a damn good option.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
That's not necessarily true.
I think his cap number is something like $6m this year. It’s quite possible that a long term deal could have his cap number lower this year before increasing in the future (big bonus over many years, low salary).
You come at the king, you best not miss.
by organizedchaos52 on Jan 31, 2012 12:44 PM EST up reply actions
Correct
His first year cap number won’t be much higher than his current number (and could be lower) if the Ravens need it to be….If they have the extra cap space to burn, they’ll front load it more.
Also look at the fact that the 2013 cap is significantly bigger than the 2012 cap.
For some of these contracts we could load them up so they take a bigger hit the second year.
I don’t see us playing in the free agency too much in 2013 because prices will definitely be inflated with more money for teams to throw around.
Flacco's cap number
in 2012 is $8,190,000 ($4.61M salary and $3.58M prorated bonus). Should be able to work something within that figure and not lose much cap room.
"the croaking raven doth bellow for revenge."
Hamlet, William Shakespeare
That occurred to me too
he wants his new deal, and it’s going to be a big one.
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
Listening to the radio this morning, I heard 3 people in a half hour say that Ozzie would be dumb to not sign Peyton Manning. Wanted to vomit.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
by Mr MaLoR on Jan 31, 2012 9:59 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
Yep, that’s a joke. He wouldn’t even pass the physical.
Jason Cole of Yahoo! Sports reports that Manning has not shown improvement in the velocity of his passes since he began throwing again in December.
…
Two unnamed "league-affiliated doctors with experience in spinal fusion surgery" tell Cole that it could take up to a year for Manning to know if he can return to action.
daytime commentator. night time ninja.
These idiots from Dundalk and Rosedale were dead serious that they would take 2 years with Manning instead of 10 more years with Flacco (because obviously Joe wouldn’t sign here if we brought someone in to replace him)
This fanbase irritates so much sometimes.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
by Mr MaLoR on Jan 31, 2012 10:07 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I was actually thinking about the Manning situation earlier. If somehow we were dumb enough to sign him a la Favre, and then somehow actually get to the SB and then win it…..I know very unlikely. I would hate it. It’d feel so hollow without the QB being Joe. It wouldn’t mean as much without Joe winning it IMO and I’d hate every minute of it. Is that crazy?
"Don't throw it, don't throw it, don't throw it. I know y'all going to throw it, they going to throw it anyway. I wouldn't throw it. Don't do it." - Ed Reed
You say tomato, I say tomahto. You say Six, I say Sweep.
by WestminsterRaven on Jan 31, 2012 11:44 AM EST up reply actions
Not at all. Most fans would feel that same way. I want Flacco to win a Superbowl more so than I do Reed. Is that crazy?
"Picture Me Rollin"
Most fans apart from those who still don’t believe in Joe like you mentioned. One dropped pass, and maybe those folks shut up a bit with the nonsense. It’ll absolutely take Joe winning a SB before some come around. You would think that Baltimore has had the best QBs ever to play since ‘96 with how some bash Joe.
As far as Reed, I’d like to see him get his. He’s banged up and put his health on the line more times than I can count for his team and it’d be a shame for one of the best ever to not get a Ring. But that’s not crazy, I know what you mean.
"Don't throw it, don't throw it, don't throw it. I know y'all going to throw it, they going to throw it anyway. I wouldn't throw it. Don't do it." - Ed Reed
You say tomato, I say tomahto. You say Six, I say Sweep.
by WestminsterRaven on Jan 31, 2012 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
Of course we all want Reed to get his ring because he deserves. But Reed doesn’t need a ring to get his respect, he is already the greatest FS to ever play the game. Joe needs a ring so that people will stop thinking he is in the same class as Mark Sanchez.
"Picture Me Rollin"
Yea, Reed is well respected and regarded by most (outside Pitt) as one of the best. It would just be a great way for him to finish.
It will take Joe getting a ring to be respected, but that’s just dumb. I respect him as a man, a QB and someone that gets shit on by his city every week and yet still puts his helmet with the Ravens logo on it each Sunday. He’s got a long career ahead and I hope that he’s here until he decides to be done.
"Don't throw it, don't throw it, don't throw it. I know y'all going to throw it, they going to throw it anyway. I wouldn't throw it. Don't do it." - Ed Reed
You say tomato, I say tomahto. You say Six, I say Sweep.
by WestminsterRaven on Jan 31, 2012 12:40 PM EST up reply actions
Every team has idiot fans. If for some reason they were able to chase Joe away, I’m pretty damn sure your buddies in Orange & Brown would snap him up quicker than you could hear a fart in a quiet church.
A bargain is something you don't need at a price you can't resist....
If I agreed with you we'd both be wrong!
My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch!
I resent those remarks MaLor
I challenge you to a duckpin bowling match in an alley behind the Box-N-Save in beloved Dundalk you North Sider.
The best things you guys got going for you is back neck river road only because of Pizza Johns.
"Picture Me Rollin"
oh yeah...
im glad the county created the loot rail system so all the theavin mofo’s can head north and pilfer your landscaped rubbemaid sheds. besides, whos got the waterfront you landlocked beltway turkey. owings mills? WTF is that. i know mr. owings was a farmer. what do you guys produce there now besides pidgeon toed Wii kids.
Oh My
landscaped rubbemaid sheds
…probably more true than anybody realizes…
This is the raven we all know and appreciate…
And the line about:
theavin mofo’s can head north and pilfer-that is pretty much universal. See West end of the Red line down here; soon to be extended (to Dulles) Orange line down here, etc…
"A little learning is a dangerous thing; Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring."
"The difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightning and a lightning bug."
"God's whiskers! Your face is as hideous as the demon's in my storybook!"
"I never expected to see the day when girls would get sunburned in the places they do today."
"It's big for a reason."
For Pittsburgh fans, that's Pope, Twain, Rostand, Rogers and Megamind
I Think
Foxworth, Carr and Ricky are gone. After that, it will be matter of when we lose somebody and it frees up some space, we sign one of the remaining ones until everybody is gone or signed.
I don’t think we franchise Rice. The track record with tagged players, especially running backs is horrific; even including the Ravens own experience. Suggs had a “bad” season (for him) when he was tagged, and if memory serves me correctly, C-MAC also had a down year the first year he was tagged (although I could be remembering incorrectly). And the NFL history with running backs who were tagged/contract disputes is just ugly.
That is why I think we work a deal with both Flacco and Rice and tag Grubbs. From my other post, I believe we can do those three players like that based upon our current cap situation and cutting Foxworth. For the rest of the UFA’s and RFA’s, we will need ot create room: cutting Carr, Ricky, et al, should start to free up some room. Would like to to resign Redding, JJ, and lock Lardarius up long term, but those are luxurious and we may only be able to do one of those three -in which case it has to be sign Lardarius to a long term deal. I would really like to to keep JJ and Redding, but I just don’t see how that is going to be possible.
"A little learning is a dangerous thing; Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring."
"The difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightning and a lightning bug."
"God's whiskers! Your face is as hideous as the demon's in my storybook!"
"I never expected to see the day when girls would get sunburned in the places they do today."
"It's big for a reason."
For Pittsburgh fans, that's Pope, Twain, Rostand, Rogers and Megamind
I see Ricky coming back, we really have no idea what Allen could do.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
I really think it could go either way. I though Allen looked pretty good in pre-season and RB isn’t a position that takes years to develop. I think it will just depend on if we do sign Grubbs and whoever else. I think Foxworth is gone, Carr is more than likely gone, then I think Lee and Ricky are 50/50. That’s a high salary for Lee that I’m not sure we will be willing to play with all these other guys to re-sign. I personally would rather keep Mcclain or JJ over Lee if it comes down to it. I think we will be solid at MLB with Mcclain and then drafting another MLB.
On Ed Reed:
"I’ve told him to his face many times, ‘You’re the greatest safety ever to play the game,’"
"We all learn from each other, but we all learn most from him."
- Troy Polamalu
I hope
we can lock up McClain on a longer term deal for 4 or so years, show him he is appreciated. Lee Evans is a nice guy to have around, but if he isn’t doing the things we need from him (holding onto the damn ball!), let him go or make him restructure. Let him go if he won’t, Torrey stepped up big time, we just need a #3 WR and Lee is getting paid like a #2. We can get more for that money.
by Rayisyourdaddy on Feb 7, 2012 11:47 AM EST up reply actions
But it’s a 2-year deal that he’s extremely unlikely to restructure and that cap number is a bit high.
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
WRONG!
Don't let my defense dictate your offense..
by lastcallbmore on Feb 8, 2012 9:40 PM EST up reply actions
WHAT????
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
by jackmca on Feb 9, 2012 12:08 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
Ray Rice is a stand up guy and team player
so I don’t think tagging him will have a negative impact. Ray has even said somewhere (sry I don’t remember where and don’t have a link) that he understands the franchise tag.
I would love to keep Ray and Grubbs though
by GayleG on Jan 31, 2012 5:32 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
*understands
that that the Ravens use it as a way to buy time
by GayleG on Jan 31, 2012 5:33 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
I’m sure most of these guys understand that. The one guy we absolutely cannot franchise, for a number of painfully obvious reasons, is Flacco.
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
Reed, the good one
Did you allow for Ed Reed not returning ? I missed it if you did. As great as he is (or was) this was a poor year. My impression watching him tackle was that he was afraid of being permanently hurt. I think this shows good sense on his part, but is a bad way to approach playing. Will be sorry to see him go, just as it was wrenching to see Unitas traded long ago.
by DennisH in Raleigh on Jan 31, 2012 1:56 PM EST reply actions
While the year overall wasn’t a typical Reed year, he stepped his game up when we needed it most in the playoffs. He made several big plays.
On Ed Reed:
"I’ve told him to his face many times, ‘You’re the greatest safety ever to play the game,’"
"We all learn from each other, but we all learn most from him."
- Troy Polamalu
Yes I included Reed
I do think he’ll come back next year, if for no other reason than it is a $7.2M salary year for him. His cap number is a healthy $10,025,000. By the way, 2012 is the final year of his current contract, so he could be a restructure candidate too.
"the croaking raven doth bellow for revenge."
Hamlet, William Shakespeare
That’s possible. Maybe wishful thinking, but it’s possible that he might take a little less just to make one last shot at a ring.
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
How do cuts work?
For example, if Ricky WIlliams was signed to a 2 year deal, and is just finishing his first, can the ravens just cut him, not paying him the rest of his contract?
I guess I’m not familiar with non-guaranteed contracts…if you sign someone in the NHL, you have to pay them the entirety of their contract whether or not you choose to cut them. As for salary cap, if you cut someone and send them to minor leagues, you still pay their salary, and about half of that year’s salary counts towards the team’s cap hit.
Montreal Canadiens///Toronto Blue Jays///Baltimore Ravens
Yeah in the NFL only a portion of the contract is guaranteed and a few occassions where none of it is guaranteed.
On Ed Reed:
"I’ve told him to his face many times, ‘You’re the greatest safety ever to play the game,’"
"We all learn from each other, but we all learn most from him."
- Troy Polamalu
Is there a standard length/amount of guaranteed contract? Or does that change depending on value of player to org.?
Montreal Canadiens///Toronto Blue Jays///Baltimore Ravens
Yeah it changes depending on the player and how their agent can negotiate. There is a rookie scale that went into place this season, so rookies have a set length/ amount in place.
On Ed Reed:
"I’ve told him to his face many times, ‘You’re the greatest safety ever to play the game,’"
"We all learn from each other, but we all learn most from him."
- Troy Polamalu
Wow…that’s so brutal for players. And leaves so much space for gm to make moves. If I were a parent, though, I would make my kids play baseball…guaranteed contracts ftw.
Montreal Canadiens///Toronto Blue Jays///Baltimore Ravens
and/or throw a good knuckleball, they’ll play until they’re 45.
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
That's why players don't like the franchise tag
Even though they get a good salary for one year, what they really want is the bonus money because that is guaranteed. But if you get injured during your franchise year, you are truly SOL.
"the croaking raven doth bellow for revenge."
Hamlet, William Shakespeare
not sure i understand
What do you mean by ‘franchise tag’? Ray Rice has that, yes? And he makes much more than any other player (according to above salary chart). Are you saying that a player of his stature would rather a lesser contract and large bonuses?
Montreal Canadiens///Toronto Blue Jays///Baltimore Ravens
Franchise tag
Under the CBA, a team can Franchise one player who would otherwise be an unrestricted free agent – which means they must pay him the average salary of the top 3 players at his position. The Ravens have not yet “franchised” Rice but probably will if they are unable to agree to contract terms before he would become a FA.
This is what they did with Ngata last year. As a franchise player, he would have gotten a 1-yr contract at about $10M. That is all he was guaranteed to get should he have had a career ending injury during the year.
They were able to negotiate his contract before the season started, so instead of $10M guaranteed, he got a one year salary of only about $2.1M but also signing bonuses worth $35M ($25M last year and $10M this year). So he was guaranteed $37.1M no matter what happens.
"the croaking raven doth bellow for revenge."
Hamlet, William Shakespeare
Have the Ravens ever used the franchise tag on an offensive player before?
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel
by Ampallang on Feb 1, 2012 7:42 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I was thinking it would have been a lineman.
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel
Only used the tag three times total
Williams, Suggs a few years back, and McAlister in 2003, I believe.
and those bonuses are also subject to salary cap?
by captain dobey on Feb 1, 2012 8:13 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I think we are pretty good if we just sign Grubbs, Rice and Gurode (1 or 2 year contract). We of course need to keep Webb on the team long term and give Carry Williams a decent contract. Everyone else can take a dramatic pay cut or find another team. I think the only guys I would be upset about losing would be Zibi and JJ, but I think both would gladly take a pay cut to remain on the team and possibly win a ring this year.
Foxworth is gone, Carr is gone Evans is gone and then resigned probably and everyone else is give permission to test our FA while we offer lower contracts.
Monkey Feces for OC!
by Mstevens_Design on Jan 31, 2012 6:34 PM EST reply actions
It is a Buyer's Market year
If Casserly was right and 25% of the players are going to be FA’s, and the Salary Cap remains stable, there will be a lot of players looking to make one year deals waiting for the new TV money to kick in next year when the cap will definitely go up. And lots of teams (e.g. Pittsburgh) are in cap hell for 2012. So that should help us with the JJ’s and Reddings, but probably not with Grubbs or Rice. Premium players tend to have their own market unaffected by economics.
"the croaking raven doth bellow for revenge."
Hamlet, William Shakespeare
by Fandemonium on Jan 31, 2012 8:17 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
awesome analysis Fan, both in the post and on the thread
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
I agree that a lot of smaller time guys could stick around waiting for better money next year, but we absolutely lock up Rice and Grubbs this year. It was proven that we need both of those guys, but I can see us structuring Rice’s contract to where we can get rid of him in a year or 2 if he hits that RB wall without mortgaging our cap future.
Really, there are very few contracts we have to give out this year. Aside from the few I mentioned, I really think we have so much good depth that we wouldn’t miss most of these guys aside from hearing the names. Given how we cut guys last year, I really can’t see us being too fanatic about guys like JJ unless they lower their cap numbers to help out with upgrading at spots..
Monkey Feces for OC!
by Mstevens_Design on Feb 3, 2012 12:15 PM EST up reply actions
I love Zbi, I’m a die hard Notre Dame fan who has followed him since he was a freshman, but honestly I’m not sure we’d really miss him.
I know you think he’s starting caliber and could out-perform Ed Reed at this stage, but that’s just absurd. He’s a good rotational player in the secondary. That’s who he is.
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
Agreed if we can sign him cheap then I’m all for it, but someone could go after him and we can’t get into a bidding war. I think Ruki could be a lot cheaper, so we may just try and keep him.
On Ed Reed:
"I’ve told him to his face many times, ‘You’re the greatest safety ever to play the game,’"
"We all learn from each other, but we all learn most from him."
- Troy Polamalu
Ruki will be cheap and he is a good utility player playing whereever we ask him to in the secondary.
I’d be surprised if we drop him.
by Roa on Feb 1, 2012 9:25 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Agreed--that versatility is key
He’s a good veteran influence on special teams, and even though he’s officially an SS he has shown enough coverage skills to play nickel while Zbi just watches on the sidelines. This guy has the competitive drive and team player attitude to do anything he can to help the Ravens. He will not be asking for a big salary, and Zbi has never been impressive as a returner so I don’t really value that contribution from him.
We need the depth at that position with Zibi. I do think he could perform just as well as Reed did this year minus that 1 game Reed had. I think we could sign Zibi to a decent but small contract and have a good guy around for some time that can step in and be a starter if Reed decides its time to call it quits. If you think that is absurd, I’d love to hear who you have starting if Reed doesn’t come back and then who would be the backup just in case.
Monkey Feces for OC!
by Mstevens_Design on Feb 3, 2012 12:10 PM EST up reply actions
I personally think Reed’s true replacement isn’t on this team. Zbi is a good stop gap, but I don’t see him as the long term answer. Zbi is a good solid player, but I think they want to find someone who’s more of an impact player than Zbi. I think we will have to draft that guy. As far as for this season it will just all depend on how much money he wants. If there’s not a big market for him then I’m sure we will bring him back if possible. Also to the he can perform as well as Reed I would disagree. Don’t know if you have seen it but they got a picture of the inside of Bradys arm band when we played and he had a 4 item list to remember for every play. 1. Knees flexed. 2. Down, Down. 3. No turnovers. 4. Find number 20. That should say it all.
On Ed Reed:
"I’ve told him to his face many times, ‘You’re the greatest safety ever to play the game,’"
"We all learn from each other, but we all learn most from him."
- Troy Polamalu
Look, my statements get taken out of context at times apparently. I don’t think Zibi is the end all to our Safety issue. He can easily step in for a year if need be and he’s a solid backup. In all reality, no one is replacing Reed, but I do think Zibi could have a solid year next year with 3-4 INTs and perform as well if not better than Reed did this year (missed tackles and out of position at times). Will Zibi or anyone on this team perform like Reed did during the prime of his career…. no, but I’ve never mentioned anything about that.
That all said, I don’t think Zibi asks for a lot of money. He could go to a place like Indy, but I think he likes the guys he’s with and I think he’d be alright with a 2 year contract and then maybe going somewhere else at that time.
Monkey Feces for OC!
by Mstevens_Design on Feb 6, 2012 3:10 PM EST up reply actions
Great work Fan
the Front Page has been looking better and better with bmore, westminster and fans work appearing more frequently (no offense to Bruce, he does great stuff, but its always good to have a diversity of writers).
Yeah you certainly made a convincing case that Evans, Williams, and Carr will all be gone. Johnson is also looking more and more like a possible cap casualty
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
Thanks
Appreciate the kind words.
"the croaking raven doth bellow for revenge."
Hamlet, William Shakespeare
Dump Zbi and Nak. These are just a couple of light weights who can be replaced by some solid 4th-5th rounders. They peaked years ago. I’d like to see some more size back there with some more punch. I’d lke to keep Carr. Maybe we can trade Oher. Ricky and Evans can go. We have lots of room for nice college players. Can we steal Blount from Tampa?
dumb
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
by jackmca on Feb 8, 2012 8:30 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
Is Peyton The Answer?
With Peyton Manning most likely being on the Free Agency market this off-season, do the Ravens take a look at the future Hall Of Fame QB? Flacco has done well for most young QB’s in the league, but it seems that when it comes to crunch time, he comes up short. With The Ravens bringing in Jim Caldwell to be the new QB coach, there is familiarity between Peyton & Caldwell, there wouldn’t have to be that much of an overhaul of the offense. The Ravens could also bring in FA WR Reggie Wayne another Miami U alumni to fill the spot of Lee Evans, so that Peyton would have at least one receiver on the team he’s(Peyton) familiar with. Understanding that salary cap plays into all of this, and the team would most likely have to trade Flacco if this move was made, considering a half healthy Peyton is better than a 100% Flacco, this is a move that as a DIE HARD FAN, I hope the Ravens Front Office considers. We are SO very close to a SuperBowl Championship, we only need one more piece to the puzzle and that’s a QB who can get the job done in the clutch; so again I ask, Is Peyton the Answer?
First of all I hope this is a joke and second of all Hell no. Flacco didn’t drop the pass or miss the field goal and there is a 0% chance of Peyton ending up in a Ravens uniform. Flacco is our guy. Deal with it.
On Ed Reed:
"I’ve told him to his face many times, ‘You’re the greatest safety ever to play the game,’"
"We all learn from each other, but we all learn most from him."
- Troy Polamalu
by AV23 on Feb 6, 2012 3:18 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
You just put about $20 million to our cap. There is absolutely no way this happens. Reggie Wayne is a maybe, but still probably not.
Monkey Feces for OC!
by Mstevens_Design on Feb 6, 2012 3:28 PM EST up reply actions
do the Ravens take a look at the future Hall Of Fame QB?
No.
Flacco has done well for most young QB’s in the league
Actually, he’s done well for most young QB’s in NFL history.
but it seems that when it comes to crunch time, he comes up short.
Why did Flacco have to drop that game winning pass to send us to the Superbowl?
With The Ravens bringing in Jim Caldwell to be the new QB coach, there is familiarity between Peyton & Caldwell, there wouldn’t have to be that much of an overhaul of the offense.
This is all just booty chatter.
The Ravens could also bring in FA WR Reggie Wayne another Miami U alumni to fill the spot of Lee Evans, so that Peyton would have at least one receiver on the team he’s(Peyton) familiar with.
More booty chatter.
Understanding that salary cap plays into all of this, and the team would most likely have to trade Flacco if this move was made
Which would be the dumbest move this front office could ever make. I would not support this team if this happened.
considering a half healthy Peyton is better than a 100% Flacco
Not really, but whatever gets your nipples hard.
this is a move that as a DIE HARD FAN, I hope the Ravens Front Office considers.
Trust me, you are far from a “die hard” fan if this is truly what you believe.
I hope the Ravens Front Office considers.
I hope you consider rooting for the Redskins instead of Baltimore.
We are SO very close to a SuperBowl Championship
We are well aware of this.
we only need one more piece to the puzzle
WR that can catch a pass?
and that’s a QB who can get the job done in the clutch
Flacco has EIGHT 4th quarter or OT comebacks in his short career, would have been 9. Compared to a really good QB like Big Ben, Flacco has half as many comeback wins as him in more than half the time in the league (not a knock on Ben though)
so again I ask
What dumb question were you asking again? I got caught up in the stupidity.
Is Peyton the Answer?
No.
"Picture Me Rollin"
by Mr MaLoR on Feb 6, 2012 3:35 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
I approve of this block quoting.
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel
by Ampallang on Feb 6, 2012 11:11 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
manning would be better with his left arm strapped to his side while hopping in a potato sack. feelings aside, flacco’s ass would be on the bench if manning were available for a year.
the question is it worth losing flacco in the long run…..for 1 year of manning. i say to you- only if troy smith is available.
says the most prominent example of Raven’s fandom. The elite…the amazing, the never wrong Ms Malor…YAY!!!!…
He can recite the most useless of stats to try to hype up bad players he thinks are awesome…he can insult anyone that don’t agree with him to mask his insecurities…he can cry, he can Giselle the Bengals blog about his QB………it’s MS MALOR the MAGNIFICENT!!!!!
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
poor form frank
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
by jackmca on Feb 8, 2012 12:46 PM EST via Android app up reply actions 6 recs
oops…I forgot an important point "he can recycle the same arguments over and over and over and over again !!!!!!!
(examples: Uggs, go root for another team, Dundalk, etc..)
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
in an attempt to call someone a troll you provided an example yourself
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
by jackmca on Feb 8, 2012 12:48 PM EST via Android app up reply actions 6 recs
You Can
Disagree with MaLoR, and I wish you had done so respectfully but alas you chose not to. Right or wrong, and you may not like it, but MaLoR has way more history and credibility on these boards than most folks, especially over garden variety squeeler fans.
Not the best move to go crap all over someone’s house when you are a guest.
"A little learning is a dangerous thing; Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring."
"The difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightning and a lightning bug."
"God's whiskers! Your face is as hideous as the demon's in my storybook!"
"I never expected to see the day when girls would get sunburned in the places they do today."
"It's big for a reason."
For Pittsburgh fans, that's Pope, Twain, Rostand, Rogers and Megamind
by vlad755 on Feb 8, 2012 1:31 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
This Frank kid has some strange obsession with me. He follows me around like herpes, even when a comment I state has absolutely nothing to do with him.
"Picture Me Rollin"
by Mr MaLoR on Feb 8, 2012 1:36 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Sorry about your case of herpes. I’m not obsessed with you, my hate for you is only because I don’t know who you are as a person. I’m just trying to find that out so I can eliminate the hate.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
I’m just trying to find that out so I can eliminate the hate.
Maybe you could just not act like a douche bag. Save the invective for Evan Skev.
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel
You have a point. Unfortunately other people are involved, and it is a Ravens blog. I don’t feel I’m doing anything different than he does at our site( mostly joking, but still starting crap with people)
Oh well, it happens. Sorry you were offended.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
Sorry you were offended.
vlad755 didn’t come off as offended at all. I read it as a very polite request for you to not be a douche bag. You’ve bragged in the past that you only act like that in response to Evan Skev, but that seems to have changed recently.
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel
Maybe he wasn’t offended, but it’s not out of line to think he took some offense to it, based on his response.
As far as “bragging” I definitely wouldn’t call it that. I will again point out that I see very little difference between Evan and Malor. The only difference is, at least Malor is somewhat educated.
I don’t think you can use the broad stroke of “that seems to have changed recently” when we are only talking about one other person. I’m sorry that you feel the need to support your two faced, arrogant, undeservedly cocky, police certified stalker, Beatdown Buddy, despite the fact that all he does is talk shit about you guys anywhere outside of these pages.
I’ll tell you one thing though, if he/she would stop the b.s he/she does at our boards, I’d stop with the comments I make to him/her. Apparently, in his/her olive branch email he/she sent me, I’m “ruining” your board. Well, I feel like he/she is ruining ours.
But seriously, I think the problem is that just don’t know who I am as a person…..
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
despite the fact that all he does is talk shit about you guys anywhere outside of these pages.
I would love to see where I said anything bad about the posters here other than Evan Skev (whom I rarely even acknowledge anymore) or raven (who everyone here jokes with for his rather strange views). Please provide example of me talking bad about Amp, Vlad, Jackmca, etc. Thanks.
if he/she would stop the b.s he/she does at our boards
Ive stuck to strictly football at BTSC, always have, always will. You don’t find it the slightest bit strange that multiple people there welcome my opinion over the likes of some Steeler fans that post there? If you could please find any personal attacks to some of the fellow regular Steeler fans I converse with over there, please provide them.
I’m sorry that you feel the need to support your two faced, arrogant, undeservedly cocky, police certified stalker, Beatdown Buddy
I seriously have no idea what I have ever said to you other than that I would stop responding to your comments because it was worthless trying to debate FOOTBALL with you. While on the other hand, you are here questioning my sexual traits and throwing out other personal attacks.
Seriously man, you have taken this crap way too far. I didn’t give a shit seeing you respond to EVERY comment I made (none of which referenced you….ever) with some dumb shit about me providing useless stats about Flacco (all of which have been validated by multiple contributors of this blog, if you don’t think so, please debate it).
Each and every comment of mine has been followed up by one of your ignorant comments referring to me as a woman, stalker, etc. Anytime these types of rants go off, it brings down the validity and quality of this wonderful blog which many people frequent daily to get Ravens news, not see some sick and confused young man continually bring down the quality of discussion we wish to have.
Not once have I ever gone on these personal rants towards a SINGLE one of your fellow Steeler fans where they have absolutely nothing to do with football. And not once have I ever “stalked” your comments like you have mine. It seems to me that you were very, very offended by the fact that I chose to ignore any bullshit that came out of your mouth to the point where you have followed me around like a child.
Good day sir, I’ll be praying for you.
"Picture Me Rollin"
by Mr MaLoR on Feb 9, 2012 1:05 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
So, in order to prove my point, I have to do work? I’m sorry, I don’t think you are worth digging through the archives for the comments where you say “you guys are interesting, and most of our fans are idiots” If anyone is that curious, they can look it up themselves.
They can also look up on the Bengals boards where you say the same thing, but also say that shit about us at this blog.
Now you want to say you’ve ‘stuck strictly to football"
Well…here is just one example I found in about 15 seconds that says you’re full of shit
Most of the older women around here don’t have trouble growing them in the first place.
Obviously football related…you win…
You are incorrect in your assessment of why I think it’s so fun to mess with you until I get a response. I’ll refresh your memory.
A) you always talk shit about us, and joke around “dissing” our team. Then, someone does it back to you, and you take your ball and go home to mommy. It was never about “debating football” it was about you professing your love for Flacco, and not accepting any opinion that didn’t support your opinion, even if it was just a joke.
B) You’re a hypocrite in every sense of the word
I never questioned your sexual traits, just your unhealthy obsessions.
Thanks for your prayers, much appreciated.
But while you may not have made a personal “rant” you have in fact made plenty of personal comments toward fellow Steeler fans.
But, I know…that’s different…
Twist it any way you want, I don’t care. You can say I’m stalking you (convenient choice of words since not only me, but other members of this blog, the Bengals blog, and our blog all saw the same thing) But, I read blogs, and y our name is there. I don’t go out of my way looking for it.
And your comment of "quality of discussion we wish to have’ is cute as hell. Why don’t you look at your own history, and how many times you’ve told anyone that doesn’t say “Flacco is teh best lolz…we rox…” that what they said is dumb. Since you want to send people on research missions, I will too. The answer is “more than a couple”
Thank you for your time
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
So, in order to prove my point, I have to do work?
Welcome to the real world. If you have a point to make, the onus is on you to prove it. I know you spend a lot of time replying to Evan Skev, who hardly sets any kind of respectable standard of dialogue; many of the rest of us actually have standards, though.
A) you always talk shit about us, and joke around "dissing" our team. Then, someone does it back to you, and you take your ball and go home to mommy. It was never about "debating football" it was about you professing your love for Flacco, and not accepting any opinion that didn’t support your opinion, even if it was just a joke.
B) You’re a hypocrite in every sense of the word
You talk a big game about how Mr MaLoR picks and chooses his Flacco-related stats. I have yet to see you dispute one of them without resorting to some ridiculous plea to ignorance. If the stats that Mr MaLoR provides are in error, address those errors. Otherwise, shut the fuck up, and stop your bitching. You won’t find many sympathetic ears here.
But while you may not have made a personal "rant" you have in fact made plenty of personal comments toward fellow Steeler fans.
Believe it or not, you’re on a Ravens blog. If you can’t handle a negative bias towards the Steelers, maybe you should re-evaluate your blogging preferences.
And your comment of "quality of discussion we wish to have’ is cute as hell. Why don’t you look at your own history, and how many times you’ve told anyone that doesn’t say "Flacco is teh best lolz…we rox…" that what they said is dumb.
The issue is that there is no serious evidence that Flacco is sub-par by any independent metric. As you said above, “I have to do work?” In order to prove that Flacco is somehow holding back the Ravens, yes, you’ll have to do some work. A lot of it, in fact. His statistical regression during the recent season has been a topic of serious discussion here. I’m looking forward to new insights from you, as you seem to consider Mr MaLoR’s opinions of Flacco to be invalid.
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel
by Ampallang on Feb 9, 2012 1:58 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I find your desire to defend someone like him strange, but oh well. Maybe in the “real world” someone would need to provide what you are looking for. But in this case, he is attempting to put the burden on me, when anything I say to him is based on things he’s done or said to me or people around me in the past. He has, as long as I’ve been aware of him, said one thing to one group, and another to other groups. These things can be found by looking it up, I don’t see why I have to prove a point here.
For your point about his useless stats, I never said it was always about Flacco. Sometimes it stupid shit like “Dennis Pitta is 18th among starting tight ends in receptions” BFD man…great… it proves nothing. There are also times when he’ll say that all that matters are stats, but then when stats don’t support his claim, he’ll say “it’s not always about stats”. The point really isn’t whether his ridiculous stats are true or not, it’s more about how he uses them to try to make a point, and the fact that in the big picture, they don’t mean shit. That said, If you think I’m looking for a sympathetic ear (eyes) here, I really don’t know what to tell you.
For your last paragraph. (sorry, I am not on your level block quote wise…yes, I could do it…but that’s your thing, I don’t want to intrude). why are you making it all about Flacco again? I have given my objective opinions about him, but why are you so convinced that anything related to Malor and I are because of Flacco? That seems short sighted to me.
I can’t say nothing he/she says is factual, what I can say is that that trying to hold him responsible for the fact that the quality of his team afforded him the luxury of not only making the playoffs, but an opportunity to beat up on weak opponents so that he can claim responsibility for “being the first QB to win a playoff game in their first four years”
You seem to be defensive, and it’s understandable, but again, I never said everything he says is invalid, I just find some of the ridiculous claims he makes to be really funny. And it’s mostly based in that “stats prove everything..until stats prove me wrong, then stats don’t matter” mindset he always has.
Hope that helped
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
why are you making it all about Flacco again?
Because that is the initial reason why you have started up with all this crap!
Everything started because of this fan post (where I used everything at my disposal to disagree with your ridiculous claims)
http://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2011/11/7/2545929/more-than-a-fluke-loss
"Picture Me Rollin"
Well…here is just one example I found in about 15 seconds that says you’re full of shit
Most of the older women around here don’t have trouble growing them in the first place.
You obviously don’t understand the long standing jokes that we share here regarding our beloved town of Baltimore. Wouldn’t expect you to though since you know nothing about Baltimore and this blog full of crazy folks.
"Picture Me Rollin"
you always talk shit about us, and joke around "dissing" our team
I say things such as “the steelers suck, you got swept, Ike Taylor is overrated, Ben is nothing special.” It is what happens when discussing FOOTBALL. You actually talk more shit about me personally than you do the Ravens.
You can say I’m stalking you (convenient choice of words since not only me, but other members of this blog, the Bengals blog, and our blog all saw the same thing)
Saw what same thing? That I said people hate on Joe because they don’t understand the type of person he is? Our owner, Steve Bisciotti, made similar comments. It was asked to Steve….
How much of that do you think has to do with his personality, which is perceived to be laid back?
In which he answered….
I think a lot of it, I really do. I think that it is perceived as a weakness when you’re young
This was exactly what I got at when I said that. You really have no idea what kind of personalty Joe has, and us Ravens do. And because of his personalty, you think that he is a terrible QB since you have no basis for arguing his numbers (which are as good as any QB in NFL history to start a career.)
Flacco is teh best lolz…we rox…
Could you please find where I used this type of 10 year language like you just did? If anyone ever said that, it was clearly you.
that what they said is dumb.
Because most of what the Flacco bashers say is dumb. It is dumb to say he is in the same group as Sanchez. It is dumb to say that there is a better logical option out there for us to succeed with. It is dumb to say that he is not a top 20 QB. It is dumb to say that we would be better off with Peyton Manning for 1 year than Flacco for 10 years.
"Picture Me Rollin"
Because most of what the Flacco bashers say is dumb. It is dumb to say he is in the same group as Sanchez
So, the fact that their first couple years, they had similar stats and playoff records, means comparing them is dumb?
I thought that Flacco’s playoff wins was your ace in the hole? Now it’s not?
It is dumb to say that we would be better off with Peyton Manning for 1 year than Flacco for 10 years.
Ok, hypothetically speaking, say..Manning comes in, and you guys win a Super Bowl, and he’s gone the next year, and mr sensitivity’s feelings are hurt because his team didn’t give him as much respect as they gave Tebow, or whatever it is this time. But he mans up and gets over it, and things go on as usual. It’s not worth it?
Hypothetical situation B. You keep Flacco, don’t sign Manning, he plays for ten years, but this season is the closest you ever get to a Super Bowl. You’d rather have that? Just so he doesn’t get his feelings hurt? How is that dumb? Which do you prefer? A Ravens championship, or Flacco not having his feelings hurt?
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
The fact that you couldnt even check to see how far apart Sanchez and Flacco’s stats are (QB rating and TD/INT ratio) really fucks up what little credibility you have.
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
by jackmca on Feb 10, 2012 8:43 AM EST via Android app up reply actions 1 recs
You just don’t know Frank as a person.
"Picture Me Rollin"
by Mr MaLoR on Feb 10, 2012 10:30 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Why don’t you guys sign Manning. Clearly he is better than Big Ben and you guys would have gotten past the first round if you had him, right!?
Its a stupid argument. You would have to wreck your salary cap and hope that the guy is healthy enough to play for the first year, much less another few more years to warrant the cap death. For that matter, Ben’s and Flacco’s stats are pretty close, so by saying that Flacco is a bum, you are calling Ben a bum.
Normally, you bring more to the table than this trash. Come on Frank, you are better than this.
Monkey Feces for OC!
by Mstevens_Design on Feb 10, 2012 9:40 PM EST up reply actions
I think you missed the point. The point was that there is at least some positive that could come out of taking on a “team friendly” (as he says) contract to give it one good shot at the prize. So, there is no reason to call the guy suggesting it dumb, just because he brings up the possibility. Your team wasn’t 22 million over the cap at the time. (now only 4.5) like ours was. And there are some talking heads that still feel Flacco is the thing holding your team back (right or wrong, it’s out there)
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
Well the issue here is that the reasoning is wrong. Making the statement on a forum that generally supports Flacco with some ridiculous half assed reasoning behind it was goofy for a newcomer and straight trolling from a guy like you.
You know what you are doing, at least man up to it and just admit you are trolling here. You want to push people’s buttons, especially Malor, and you know to go after Flacco to do it. I really don’t have too much of a problem with it, but to keep going like no one knows what you are doing is a little lame man.
And there are some talking heads that still feel Flacco is the thing holding your team back (right or wrong, it’s out there)
There are also some talking heads that think Dennis Dixon is the answer for your QB problems. See how stupid that sounds just because some moron like Jay Glazer says it.
Monkey Feces for OC!
by Mstevens_Design on Feb 11, 2012 5:01 PM EST up reply actions
Yes, you are correct. That is the reason for the little jabs, but the main point is really what I’m getting at. The guy made a comment, sort of asked a question, and was called dumb. When someone sends me an email like Malor did, and says the things he says I do, while ignoring the things he does, that sort of sucks.
I am curious, who said Dennis Dixon is the answer? We actually have a few people at BTSC that think he should have been playing from the first Cleveland game on. (although not to replace Ben if healthy)
He had one ok game in his career (which happened to be against you guys), I don’t know what BTSC’ers see in him.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
The guy made a comment, sort of asked a question, and was called dumb.
It was a dumb comment and a dumb sort of question. It wasn’t based on anything more than a guy that watches 2 Ravens games a year and wouldn’t know what a good QB looks like. Even with that, its been explained on here so many times that Flacco is the future of the franchise (whether by the organization or by the research of fellow fans on his stats).
When someone sends me an email like Malor did
Then respond to him in Email. Why not keep it between you 2 versus taking up an entire forum and making this look ridiculous?
I am curious, who said Dennis Dixon is the answer?
No one, but that wasn’t my point here. You are arguing that this kid actually has a point and I’m arguing that just by his stupid comment (“Joe isn’t as good as an unhealthy Manning”), he isn’t making any valid point at all. Just like someone saying Dennis Dixon is the answer is obviously someone that should be ridiculed a bit.
On top of all that, I just looked back at Malor’s response and remembered that it isnt bad at all. He highlights every one of the kids points and, while he sarcastically puts them down, explains that it doesn’t make sense. 10 seconds worth of reading and its obvious that he was being short with the kid, but telling him that Flacco didn’t lose the AFC title game for us, so looking at Manning is an idiotic knee jerk response. The kid has also had plenty of time to respond and back up his opinion with any fact or even sound reasoning and he hasn’t done it. Its the typical thing where someone comes around, makes a wild statement and we never see them again.
You are making something on that where there isn’t anything and you are taking a personal issue with Malor and making it public when it doesn’t need to be.
Monkey Feces for OC!
by Mstevens_Design on Feb 13, 2012 1:10 PM EST up reply actions
And here’s a pro tip. You don’t have to look far for an example of your arrogant attitude that says anyone that doesn’t agree with you is an idiot, it’s in this thread.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
You don’t have to look far for an example of your arrogant attitude that says anyone that doesn’t agree with you is an idiot …
By what metric is Mr MaLoR wrong? You continue complaining about what he says, but you offer no evidence to the contrary.
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel
What metric? Is there a website I can look up that has statistics of people claiming others are wrong, and people who have been said to have been wrong, but are actually right? If so, lead me to it.
If you want a recent example though, I can point you to the guy who asked the simple question of “should we try to get Peyton Manning” followed by Malor’s usual “you’re dumb, everything you say is dumb” response that is undoubtedly rooted in his obsession with Flacco’s sexy stache.
Maybe that guy was wrong about Manning (though, honestly, I can’t see how he’d hurt you guys right now), but does that mean that Malor has the right to call them dumb? Question their dedication to the team?
That’s just one example. If you really feel it’s necessary, I will find more tomorrow.
You are correct, I can’t offer any evidence that Manning would be a great pick up for you. You know why? Because it’s hypothetical. I don’t try to conjure up evidence for something that can’t possibly be proven or disproved.
However, if there is any contrary evidence that I can provide, just let me know what it is, I’ll find it.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
Is there a website I can look up that has statistics of people claiming others are wrong, and people who have been said to have been wrong, but are actually right? If so, lead me to it.
There is a great search bar at the top of the page which can find any comment made by person at any time on any blog.
"Picture Me Rollin"
For example
You have 64 comments where you talk about knowing Flacco as a person, which is a miniscule comment you took WAY out of context.
"Picture Me Rollin"
And this was a nice gem from one of the Steeler fans
FrankWyt
Can everyone please just discredit everything this guy says? He makes us look bad. After the game sunday night, i saw multiple comments on a previous thread here that bc of this loss sunday night, the Steelers were done and we’re even going to make the playoffs, etc etc. I dont know if who this guy is, whether he is a persistent troll or a moron, but his comments make me feel embarassed for him.
Is Joe Flacco an "elite" quarterback? It depends on who you ask- Gruden thinks there are 41 elite quarterbacks in the league… But it doesnt really matter, Joe was good enough to beat the Steelers on sunday night.
"Picture Me Rollin"
Here is an update from that same person you chose to quote.
+1
I like your attitude. Hahaha
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
I don’t see anything irreconcilable about liking your attitude but thinking you’re a moron.
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel
Definitely. However, people throw words around when they are angry, and are unlikely to give a person they hate, or are angry with any credit for anything if they continue to harbor those feelings.
During the particular conversation that Malor cherry picked that comment from, I was actually correct about what the guy was pissed off about. (save for one, at first I did say we wouldn’t even make the playoffs, but amended it to we may make the playoffs but this team isn’t going anywhere)
But, at the very least, I can be secure in the knowledge that my comment wasn’t something that police/security would be concerned with.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
Maybe you could put it in the correct context for me then? I can’t really imagine that anyone could take something like that out of context.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
he quoted two full paragraphs man
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
by jackmca on Feb 10, 2012 8:45 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
Just give up man. You can see that he has finally tried to talk football after realizing that everyone here thinks he has some Jeffrey Dahmer type traits.
"Picture Me Rollin"
Right. I’m the one who takes it personally when someone says something bad about a player on my team. I’m the one that tried telling people they were wrong about Joe because they just didn’t know him as a person. Give me a break, I know you have your fans on here, but to try to turn it around like that?
“finally tried to talk football”? yes…sure….
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
But did you take it personally during the evening hours of the day in the month of December when it is 38 degrees outside while listening to Nickelback?
"Picture Me Rollin"
Since I’m not the one that tries to use stats similar to the ones the announcer from the movie Little Big League used in my every day arguments, that doesn’t work as well with me. And on top of that, that was just weak. I swear on everything holy and sacred, if you could have pulled it off,(I have had to begrudgingly give you your credit in the past, like your post on Tebow..good stuff)I’d give you full credit, but you didn’t.
Seriously, who listens to Nickelback? that’s my mom’s favorite band…
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
two full paragraphs of the correct context of his comment about knowing Joe as a person?
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
Please put
this quote from you, in context.
This is the problem with the Flacco hate, people don’t really know who he is as a person.
That’s all you gotta do, I won’t say anything else about it if you can put that in to context. I obviously took it “WAY” out of context.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
I’m trying to get to know the context of your person, so that I can fully understand it, and be more willing to fight to the death for it.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
this has reached a point where i would no longer dignify you with a response.
you suck dude, get banned and go away
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
by jackmca on Feb 10, 2012 11:33 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
If you want a recent example though, I can point you to the guy who asked the simple question of "should we try to get Peyton Manning" followed by Malor’s usual "you’re dumb, everything you say is dumb" response that is undoubtedly rooted in his obsession with Flacco’s sexy stache.
He talked down to a guy with very few posts on these boards that made the same argument that all Flacco haters make. The kid made no argument based in fact and only stated his opinion like it was fact. Lets be honest, you would have done the same thing to a new poster at your blog that talked about getting Manning to replace Ben. It was a stupid thing for the kid to say and he needed to be told it was stupid.
On this blog, if you come with factual evidence or even an opinion that is well explained, you usually get listened to. Granted some people will always make the “you’re stupid” comment regardless, but those people tend to be a little too obsessed with their own opinions. What that kid said had no facts in it and was an opinion backed up with more opinion and that gets a person ridiculed.
Monkey Feces for OC!
by Mstevens_Design on Feb 9, 2012 10:21 AM EST up reply actions 4 recs
What happened to the Fan Posts listed on the front page? Has the list been truncated for anyone else?
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel
Gone for me as well. SBN was down for a bit earlier (that stupid Jackie Chan 503 error picture kept popping up). Then the fanposts went away. Its like that for every site.
"Picture Me Rollin"
great picture of Chan though
"And, don’t get me started on Joe Flacco," Simms continued. "Did the experts watch the game? Joe didn’t miss a throw, not one. I watched every play. Every time he had the opportunity, he hit the guy. And, he made some moves so he could complete other throws. Are these people watching? What was Joe supposed to do with Texans in his face? Throw it up and hope? Sometimes a sack is a good thing. The object is to win the game. You did."
by jackmca on Feb 8, 2012 2:54 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
Bruce Forgot
To feed the squirrels that run the servers for SB Nation again…
"A little learning is a dangerous thing; Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring."
"The difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightning and a lightning bug."
"God's whiskers! Your face is as hideous as the demon's in my storybook!"
"I never expected to see the day when girls would get sunburned in the places they do today."
"It's big for a reason."
For Pittsburgh fans, that's Pope, Twain, Rostand, Rogers and Megamind
You're truncated!
Don't let my defense dictate your offense..
by lastcallbmore on Feb 8, 2012 9:44 PM EST up reply actions
2012 Draft
1st round- Fletcher Cox, 2nd Round- Best safety available, 3rd round- Best RB available (maybe Cyrus Gray or Vick Ballard), LB once Ray is gone? 2013 draft = Cameron Lawrence, oh yes.
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