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Joe Flacco vs. the Elite

Four games into his fourth season, Joe Flacco has completed less than 50% of his passes.  He runs hot and cold from week to week, showing no consistency.  He's been criticized for making boneheaded plays that hurt his team.  He doesn't raise his game to the level of stiff opposition.  He is no longer at a point where he can use youth as an excuse.   

Elite quarterbacks do better.  They can be trusted to throw accurate passes.  They maintain a steady level of play.  They don't give up the ball at inopportune times.  They step up their game against the toughest defenses.  By their fourth year, elite quarterbacks have shed their training wheels and can be counted on to carry their team.  And elite quarterbacks definitely do not look like deer in headlights.

At least, that's what I hear.

Some of our more vocal fellows have stars in their eyes when it comes to the great quarterbacks.  They think that Tom Brady wasn't born, but sprung full-formed from Bill Belichik's head, ready to throw touchdowns to Randy Moss.  Certain quarterbacks carry the status of elite, and those types of quarterbacks don't suffer from the same problems that the lowly Flacco has seen this year.

What I hope to show here is that these elite quarterbacks  -- in their respective fourth years -- each had down games.  In fact, they had some very down games; the type of games that would have some people around here calling for Tyrod Taylor's immediate succession.  I've selected four games from the fourth year of each of these quarterbacks that fit the bill.  Rather than looking at this as cherry picking, I see it as proof that even those that fly highest can still get caught in the mud.  In other words, a couple down games early in his career is no indication of Flacco's ceiling.  

Star-divide

For analysis, I've chosen Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, and Drew Brees from the modern era, as well as Dan Marino and Joe Montana from past generations for good measure.  I was going to include Aikman because he earned his spot in the Hall of Fame using an Air Coryell offense, but he just really sucked in his fourth year; it was like shooting fish in a barrel.  A small sample size precludes some of Flacco's popular contemporaries, but I think you could also say that Matt Ryan and Josh Freeman have fallen back to Earth relative to their performances last year.


Tom Brady

Game Comp% TD Int Rating
Week 1 50.0 0 4 22.5
Week 6 38.1 0 0 56.1
Week 11 44.1 0 0 64.8
Week 14 51.6 0 0 67.0

 

Week 1 was pretty rough, huh?  Interestingly enough, that was the only game listed here the Patriots lost.  The other three games were won via a defense that kept the opposition out of the end zone.  A stingy defense and a quarterback that didn't always put the team on his back; that sounds vaguely familiar.  Check out those completion percentages, too.  They aren't very elite.  Another point of interest here is that Brady won a Super Bowl in season four, even though he really sucked for a quarter of the season.

 

Peyton Manning

Game Comp% TD Int Rating
Week 3 58.8 1 3 48.2
Week 11 60.8 1 4 56.8
Week 13 59.4 0 3 35.0
Week 16 53.6 0 1 60.9

 

Peyton Manning is a turnover machine!  His interception total from these four games is just one shy of Flacco's interception total from 16 games last year.  Manning also had two fumbles in the listed games.  I wonder if anybody in 2001 was calling him "Blind Peyton Manning"?

 

Drew Brees

Game Comp% TD Int Rating
Week 2 42.1 1 2 47.1
Week 3 48.3 0 0 59.7
Week 7 65.6 0 0 82.3
Week 13 51.9 0 1 46.2

 

Brees doesn't fit neatly into my 5x5 grid.  His performance in Week 7 wasn't bad; it just wasn't elite, and that's really the point here.  He didn't necessarily do anything wrong, but he definitely didn't put his team on his back that week, either.  In the other three examples, God's gift to tightly covered receivers wasn't getting it done.  His vaunted accuracy disappeared, and he threw more interceptions than touchdowns.


Dan Marino

Game Comp% TD Int Rating
Week 4 58.7 1 4 49.3
Week 5 56.5 1 3 54.3
Week 6 58.5 1 1 83.1
Week 13 50.0 2 4 52.4

 

Dan Marino's completion percentage was on the low side, and he, like Manning, was turning over the ball left and right.  Like Manning, he was being asked to do much more than his fair share of the work load on his offense.  This isn't really the most fair comparison to Flacco, but it really isn't meant to be that.  I think that this just reinforces the fact that the most elite quarterbacks in the game still struggled at times in season four.


Joe Montana

Game Comp% TD Int Rating
Week 1 50.0 0 1 47.5
Week 7 63.0 0 1 61.5
Week 9 58.3 1 2 63.8
Week 13 60.5 0 2 57.8

 

Montana's fourth season was comprised of just nine games in a strike-shortened year, so these games were each pulled from his fifth season, instead.  Even with that handicap, the great Montana put up some ugly games.  He had a low completion percentage, lots of interceptions, and little in the way of end zone production.

As I mentioned in various places above, my intention isn't to compare Flacco to anybody here.  Most of these quarterbacks are either in or on their way to the Hall of Fame; even as one of his biggest supporters, I can't justify that kind of prediction for Flacco.  The point is that  a couple of poor showings in season four isn't the end of the world.  It doesn't mean we have no shot at the Super Bowl.  It doesn't mean that we've already seen the best that Flacco has to offer.  If anything, it's that the opposite is possible.  Brady had some real duds on the road to his first ring.  Each of these quarterbacks moved past very poor games to become among the best in the game.  Flacco has improved yearly, and we have no reason to think that won't continue.

The opinions posted here are those of the administrator of this blog and his loyal readers. They are in no way official comments from the team, and should not be misconstued as such, even though he thinks he could do just as well or even a better job!

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. The point is that a couple of poor showings in season four isn’t the end of the world. It doesn’t mean we have no shot at the Super Bowl. It doesn’t mean that we’ve already seen the best that Flacco has to offer.

Preach!

Flacco has improved yearly, and we have no reason to think that won’t continue.

He was supposed to have won 3 Superbowls already while putting up 4,300 yards and 33 TD’s each year. That is what QB’s do, it is that easy.

Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.

Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang

by Mr MaLoR on Oct 14, 2011 2:17 AM EDT reply actions  

Eating up the perspective Amp. Great post!

The writer formerly known as This White Man Can Jump; Powah Stached; Bear Killer; Da Dude; The Other Bambino; TJ Dropped The Season; Harbaugh Is My Co-Pilot; Billick's Alter Ego; Mr. Poopy Pants.

by El.Dude on Oct 14, 2011 7:18 AM EDT reply actions  

AMP! you KILL'T THESE FOOLS!!!!

Hold up hold up hold up. REC THIS MAN.

Gimme til later in my day when I’m not on beatdown mobile and I’ll rec this myself.

Obstacles are the things you see when you take your eyes off your goals.

by jackmca on Oct 14, 2011 7:56 AM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Waiting for shadow & RAM to wipe the nut off their faces

Excellent comparison.

by Evan Skev on Oct 14, 2011 11:57 AM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Great Piece Amp

Really puts things in perspective.

"What we've got here is failure to communicate."

by Fandemonium on Oct 14, 2011 12:50 PM EDT reply actions  

Nicely written Amp

But you may want to ease up on the optimism. Shadow and raven’s heads are about to explode!

"Is adult entertainment killing our children, or is killing children entertaining adults?"
-Marilyn Manson

by StuckInUtah on Oct 14, 2011 1:00 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

A stingy defense and a quarterback that didn’t always put the team on his back; that sounds vaguely familiar. Check out those completion percentages, too. They aren’t very elite. Another point of interest here is that Brady won his first Super Bowl in season four, even though he really sucked for a quarter of the season.

So many people in Baltimore and around the NFL world always say that Flacco has had success because of his defense and running game. What most people do not realize about Brady is that every year they won the Superbowl, their defense allowed around an average of 17 points a game. Their defenses were REALLY good during that stretch, and add Cory Dillon to the mix who had some phenominal numbers and all of a sudden Brady’s Superbowls don’t look AS good.

Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.

Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang

by Mr MaLoR on Oct 14, 2011 1:17 PM EDT reply actions  

Another point of interest here is that Brady won his first Super Bowl in season four, even though he really sucked for a quarter of the season.

I made an error here. Brady won his second Super Bowl in season four, not his first. It’s now corrected in the original post. I’m confident this error doesn’t affect my conclusion at all.

Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.

State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel

by Ampallang on Oct 14, 2011 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Didn’t even notice it. It really had nothing to do with the point I was making. Those Pats defenses were nasty in the 3 Superbowl years.

Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.

Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang

by Mr MaLoR on Oct 14, 2011 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

It really had nothing to do with the point I was making.

Full disclosure, and all that. Your point was solid either way.

Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.

State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel

by Ampallang on Oct 14, 2011 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

APPLES AND ORANGES APPLES AND ORANGES

THE NEW CHUBAKA DEFENSE rests…

by raven on Oct 20, 2011 11:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Look up...

Manning’s stat lines for each of the 2006-2007 season playoff games he played – the year they won. Talk about defense carrying an elite QB. Manning might have gotten them to the post-season in 2006, but that was sure as hell a team win every post-season game they played.

My only complaint about Flacco to date is that he has a habit of fumbling. I think his pocket movement and awareness has gotten a lot better. Completion percentage is a fickle stat, especially since it requires WRs to catch it

by OldBay83 on Oct 16, 2011 8:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

good article bout time you make a fan post amp lol

What happens to a dream deferred?
Does it dry up
Like a raisin in the sun?
Or fester like a sore--
And then run?
Does it stink like rotten meat?
Or crust and sugar over--
like a syrupy sweet?
Maybe it just sags
like a heavy load.
Or does it explode?-langton Hughes

yeah I agree with Jimmy and Cary shutting down the other teams WR’s, they’ll make anybody rushing the QB look good - Jaz

by jazz20 on Oct 14, 2011 2:16 PM EDT reply actions  

I was thinking it had been a while.

Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.

State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel

by Ampallang on Oct 14, 2011 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

where is ram? where is shadow? hello?

by Evan Skev on Oct 14, 2011 2:49 PM EDT reply actions  

Excellent analysis as always

Great job. Maybe this this quiet the haters for a little while. Probably not….but maybe.

by YeahDonnie on Oct 14, 2011 7:30 PM EDT reply actions  

meh

I’m not sold on Flacco being elite, but time will tell

The only young QBs that I think have shown elite potential so far this season are Stafford and Cam, Ryan just proving how overrated he is and Freeman’s been inconsistent.

STRAIGHT CASH HOMIE

by everybodylookin on Oct 15, 2011 12:04 AM EDT reply actions   2 recs

Grass is always greener?

First, I don’t disagree that Stafford and Cam Newton have elite potential, although both have too few games to make any conclusion. It is really too early to conclude anything on Cam except to say – he’s starting earlier and playing better than most thought. Kind of reminds me of what they were saying about a Division 1-A QB from Delaware in 2008.

Stafford has played only 18 games in 3 years. But his 3rd year stats so far are pretty good – he’s completing 63% of his passes with a 3-1 TD/INT ratio after 5 games. Whereas Flacco in his 3rd year (16 games) completed 62.6% of his passes with a 2.5 – 1 TD/INT ratio. So I guess one can say Stafford is showing as much potential as …. Flacco.

"What we've got here is failure to communicate."

by Fandemonium on Oct 15, 2011 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

the game is more than stats

Matthew and Cam have shown the most poise of any young QB.

Flacco an up and down QB, he can have a game like he did against the rams or steelers than just play like a complete bum the next week like he did against the Titans.

I believe Flacco only has 5 games of over 300 yards in his career, Ryan only has 6, but Cam on the other hand already got 3 as a rookie that everybody loved to try and say would bust. Stafford has 3 in his career and 2 this season.

But you also gotta take into account Cam has Smith and Stafford has the best receiver in the league.

STRAIGHT CASH HOMIE

by everybodylookin on Oct 15, 2011 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

But you also gotta take into account Cam has Smith and Stafford has the best receiver in the league.

Yes that does play into the factor why Cam and Stafford are putting up big numbers but at the same time with out these quarterbacks the two wideouts wouldnt be having such a great season so far

What happens to a dream deferred?
Does it dry up
Like a raisin in the sun?
Or fester like a sore--
And then run?
Does it stink like rotten meat?
Or crust and sugar over--
like a syrupy sweet?
Maybe it just sags
like a heavy load.
Or does it explode?-langton Hughes

yeah I agree with Jimmy and Cary shutting down the other teams WR’s, they’ll make anybody rushing the QB look good - Jaz

by jazz20 on Oct 15, 2011 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions  

Have you seen Calvin play? It doesn’t matter who’s throwing him the ball he will dominate. Look at the QB’s he had throwing to him last year.

On Ed Reed:
"I’ve told him to his face many times, ‘You’re the greatest safety ever to play the game,’"
"We all learn from each other, but we all learn most from him."
- Troy Polamalu

by AV23 on Oct 15, 2011 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

Have you seen Calvin play? It doesn’t matter who’s throwing him the ball he will dominate. Look at the QB’s he had throwing to him last year.

I havent watched him play often but i beleive with matthew throwing to him he will have much better season . last year Johnson only had 1,120 receiving yards his best season was actrally in 2008 when he had 1,331 receivings yards. Im not denying that he hasn’t had success with other quarterbacks but I bet he will have better year this year then he did last year if Matthew stays healthy

What happens to a dream deferred?
Does it dry up
Like a raisin in the sun?
Or fester like a sore--
And then run?
Does it stink like rotten meat?
Or crust and sugar over--
like a syrupy sweet?
Maybe it just sags
like a heavy load.
Or does it explode?-langton Hughes

yeah I agree with Jimmy and Cary shutting down the other teams WR’s, they’ll make anybody rushing the QB look good - Jaz

by jazz20 on Oct 15, 2011 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

If you watch him play you will see it’s not Stafford that makes him great (I’m sure it helps some), but most of Calvins TD’s are just jump balls where he is double and triple covered and goes over the top of them to get it. You really should watch him play more, this may be the biggest physical freak to ever step on a football field.

On Ed Reed:
"I’ve told him to his face many times, ‘You’re the greatest safety ever to play the game,’"
"We all learn from each other, but we all learn most from him."
- Troy Polamalu

by AV23 on Oct 15, 2011 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

If I'm correct,

I believe Cam has been throwing the ball a lot more than Joe did his rookie year. The Panthers’ running game really hasn’t gotten going until this past weekend I think, leading to Cam needing to air it out. They’ve also been trailing quite a bit. Furthermore, Cam was expected to start and trained that way throughout the preseason.

On the other hand, Joe came into a situation where he was expected to be on the bench on a run-first team which never lost that ability (remember the three-headed monster?). In the third preseason game he gets thrown into the starting role, which he wins by default, and I imagine most of that season was spent handing the ball off and not asking too much of him (my memory of that year is a little sparse). That is, Joe didn’t need to throw for 300 yards, so he didn’t. He did what was asked of him: guide a previously 5-11 team to an 11-5 record and an AFC Championship game by handing the ball off and not making (too many) mistakes.

You come at the king, you best not miss.

by organizedchaos52 on Oct 15, 2011 12:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

The data:

Newton’s first 5 games: 113/194, 1610 yds, 7/6 TD/INTs, 8.30 YPA
Flacco’s first 5 games: 90/144, 844 yds, 1/7 TD/INTs, 5.86 YPA

My memory actually proved to be faulty, as Newton far outperformed Joe in the first 5 games. I’d even forgotten that the 2008 Ravens (2-3) did not have a far superior record to the 2011 Panthers (1-4) after 5 games as I thought they did. Furthermore, Carolina’s run game is 11th in the league in yards, 6th in the league in YPC, and tied for 4th in the league in TDs (this includes Newton’s carries). Even removing Newton and the last game in which they ran all over the Saints, they’re still a damn good running team, which was not what I expected.

In fact, the Ravens running game those first 5 games was not particularly good, despite what seems to be a lot of carries (keep in mind, one of those games was in Pitt): 180 carries, 666 yds, 7 TDs.

The big difference seems to be in play selection. A quick glance shows that the ’08 Ravens ran 324 plays in their first 5 games, 180 runs and 144 pass attempts (just realized I forgot to include sacks, would rather not go back and look). Meanwhile the ’11 Panthers have run 318 plays, 124 rushes and 194 throws.

With all that said, I think I’d agree with you on poise. I remember Joe not looking too great early on that year, while Cam has looked pretty good from what I’ve seen.

You come at the king, you best not miss.

by organizedchaos52 on Oct 15, 2011 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

One final thing I did was to look at Newton's numbers with and without Smith.

Smith has 27 catches on 48 targets for 609 yards (a 22.3 avg, by far the highest on the team, greatly inflated by 5 catches of 50+ yards) for 3 TDs.

Removing Smith from the equation (which is hardly the best solution to finding Smith’s impact, as someone would be taking his spot were he not playing), Newton’s stats: 86/146, 1001 yds, 4 TDs, 6.85 YPA (down from 8.30), which still outperforms Flacco’s first 5 games, and I’d imagine if we removed Mason from Flacco’s stat line, his stats would look even worse.

And all of this evaluation ignores the fact that Newton has carried the ball 40 times for 160 yards and 5 TDs. That is, he is a threat to run and does so about as well as an average RB, albeit on fewer attempts. He’s no Michael Vick (at least not yet), but he’s by far more mobile than Flacco was or is (or likely ever will be).

You come at the king, you best not miss.

by organizedchaos52 on Oct 15, 2011 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

No doubt Cam has out-performed expectations

He had “bust” potential written all over him and he has certainly impressed me so far.

My “grass is always greener” point is that fans in general, and seemingly Baltimore fans in particular, are more willing to declare players on other teams great – or potentially great – while at the same time being overly critical of our own players.

In this case declaring that Cam (after 5 games) and Stafford (after 18 games) have greater elite potential than Flacco (who after 52 games has taken his team to the playoffs 3 times) is just ridiculous.

"What we've got here is failure to communicate."

by Fandemonium on Oct 15, 2011 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh, I completely agree.

I would not trade Joe for Cam. In fact, there are very few QBs I’d rather have than Joe right now (when considering the future as well). Rodgers for sure, but no others immediately spring to mind. We’ve been debating this for 3-4 years now. Joe is not Brady or Manning, and he may never be. But he is a QB that wins games (35-17, 4-3), which is more than we’ve had here in a long time (by comparison, Boller had 23 wins over 5 seasons with us, many of which were spent injured). That’s another factor that’s constantly overlooked: Joe has never missed a game (knock on wood).

Despite the fact that Cam has outperformed Flacco so far (in an admittedly small sample, even by NFL standards), his performance has not yet led to more wins. Gaudy stats look good, but wins look better.

You come at the king, you best not miss.

by organizedchaos52 on Oct 15, 2011 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

You have to take note that Cam’s team has the 20th ranked D in the league and would likely have 2 or 3 wins by now if they were better.

I wouldn’t fully judge Cam’s potential just based off 5 games but it’s blatantly obvious that it’s really high cause of how good he’s playing at age 22 and his physical attributes and size for position.

STRAIGHT CASH HOMIE

by everybodylookin on Oct 15, 2011 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

just looked on ESPN

and in each of the 4 games Carolina has lost, they’ve given up at least 28 points, but have also scored at least 21 points mostly thanks to Newton. If he had a half decent D they’d be a top 10 team in the league.

STRAIGHT CASH HOMIE

by everybodylookin on Oct 15, 2011 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yea, they might be 1-5, but they have ALOT to look forward to in the future with Cam. That team has some sick talent all over with Johnson, Beason, Williams, Stewart, Smith and their O-Line is one of the top 5 groups in the league in my opinion.

Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.

Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang

by Mr MaLoR on Oct 17, 2011 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

LaFell and Olsen give him some pass catches for the future as well

Obstacles are the things you see when you take your eyes off your goals.

by jackmca on Oct 17, 2011 7:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Flacco an up and down QB, he can have a game like he did against the rams or steelers than just play like a complete bum the next week like he did against the Titans.

It’s interesting that you’d post that in this thread, of all places. The point of my original post was to show that the greatest quarterbacks of our time, as well as the best of all time, had a number of very poor games in their fourth year. Most had four games listed, which is a quarter of the games in the season. If you can expect a dud every four games, that’s hardly consistency. You talk about Flacco’s inconsistency as if it’s something you’d never see from the best in the game, and that’s just not true at all. All the best quarterbacks were up and down in their respective fourth seasons, and it’s unfair to hold Flacco to a different standard.

Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.

State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel

by Ampallang on Oct 16, 2011 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

All the best quarterbacks were up and down in their respective fourth seasons, and it’s unfair to hold Flacco to a different standard.

All the best QBs have bad games from time to time even now. Nobody is perfect. The QB is going against a defense that wants to tear his head off every single play. And he’s at the mercy of his own team…his O line has to play well and the running game has to be decent so the defense can’t key on him all the time, and the receivers have to get open and catch the ball.

by YeahDonnie on Oct 16, 2011 11:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

his O line has to play well and the running game has to be decent so the defense can’t key on him all the time, and the receivers have to get open and catch the ball.

It almost sounds like you’re trying to say that the quarterback isn’t solely responsible for the offense’s performance, but that’d just be ridiculous.

Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.

State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel

by Ampallang on Oct 16, 2011 11:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

I know

I take it all back, I plead had temporary insanity.

by YeahDonnie on Oct 16, 2011 11:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Tom Brady is an up and down QB, he can have a game like he did against the Raiders or Jets then just play like a complete bum the next week like he did against the Cowboy (or Bills).

"What we've got here is failure to communicate."

by Fandemonium on Oct 17, 2011 7:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

lol

why you gonna try and twist what I said.

You compared Brady, a multiple superbowl champ and future hall of famer, having some off days to Flacco who hasn’t even been to the superbowl.

STRAIGHT CASH HOMIE

by everybodylookin on Oct 17, 2011 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

meant to say

That Brady has already got the right to get a pass for crappy games cause of his legacy, Flacco hasn’t.

STRAIGHT CASH HOMIE

by everybodylookin on Oct 17, 2011 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah but the fact is that Brady didnt always play super all the time .

 super bowl or no super bowl its just true that brady has had his bad days and good days.

"if you really want to know what people think about you listen to their jokes" -N.Moore

by jazz20 on Oct 17, 2011 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

2 interceptions yesterday and people still think of him as a god. Joe has 1 pick and people are calling for Tyrod Taylor.

Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.

Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang

by Mr MaLoR on Oct 17, 2011 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

hey straight cash homie… teams make it to super bowls not players

by Evan Skev on Oct 17, 2011 6:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

So only Super Bowl QBs get to have bad games?

How the hell does that make any sense at all?

So an elite QB can throw 4 picks and still be elite, but Joe throws one and he’s a bum. Your logic is flawed.

Most people would have higher expectations for an elite player than they do for your average Joe.

"What we've got here is failure to communicate."

by Fandemonium on Oct 17, 2011 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

The point is

That QB’s who are superstars/superbowl winners will get a pass for having an off game cause everyone knows that he’ll bounce back like that have in the past.

Flacco hasn’t gotten to the level where he can be excused for bad games cause of his great history.

STRAIGHT CASH HOMIE

by everybodylookin on Oct 19, 2011 10:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

So that means

Dan Marino was an up and down QB (0 SB’s)
Donovan McNabb – now he’s truly up and down (0 SB’s)
Warren Moon – mostly down (0 SB’s)
Phillip Rivers, Matt Schaub, Tony Romo, Michael Vick, Josh Freeman, Matt Ryan are all up and down QBs. (0 SB’s)

"What we've got here is failure to communicate."

by Fandemonium on Oct 19, 2011 10:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

You do realize I said superstar right? Most of the guys you listed don’t fit that standard.

and Romo, Vick, Ryan, Freeman and Schaub are up and down QB’s in my opinion.

STRAIGHT CASH HOMIE

by everybodylookin on Oct 23, 2011 9:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Flacco hasn’t gotten to the level where he can be excused for bad games cause of his great history.

Get real, dude. All quarterbacks have bad games. In fact, most of the quarterbacks I listed above had plenty of shitty games prior to winning a Super Bowl. It’s part of the game.

Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.

State your case, back it up with facts and reasonable opinions ...
Bruce Raffel

by Ampallang on Oct 19, 2011 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

I believe Flacco will become a great quarerback and like Ed Reed said on the Rich Eisen

pod cast which was Flacco has Aaron Rodgers type potentials but its up to him to put it all together. Flacco is good but he hasn’t put it all together yet which would eventually make him great.

What happens to a dream deferred?
Does it dry up
Like a raisin in the sun?
Or fester like a sore--
And then run?
Does it stink like rotten meat?
Or crust and sugar over--
like a syrupy sweet?
Maybe it just sags
like a heavy load.
Or does it explode?-langton Hughes

yeah I agree with Jimmy and Cary shutting down the other teams WR’s, they’ll make anybody rushing the QB look good - Jaz

by jazz20 on Oct 15, 2011 11:37 AM EDT reply actions  

Good post Amp. It’s what I’ve been trying to tell fans all along. Send this to The Herd, Colin Cowherd. He is a Flacco hater. He loved Sanchez & M. Ryan. He can flip easily though.

by JacktheRaven on Oct 15, 2011 4:00 PM EDT reply actions  

things that Cowherd says

are to be immediately disregarded. He just talks to get people talking. I doubt he even believes what he says.
no further proof needed then his love affair with Dirty Sanchez.
And frankly, you don’t want his love.
Last year he had a long speech about his man love for Brady, saying after they win the Super Bowl this year, they will build monuments, have a holiday named after him, and so much other bullshit. It was used as a promo for the show on the radio.
Well, you know what happened the next week now.

by FrankWyt on Oct 20, 2011 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

I used to like Cowerd before he got his TV show. When he just had the radio show, he seemed to actually give long good thought out opinions. Now it just seems like he’s going for the shock factor.

To add on to it, the douche gets to hang out with Beadle every day. Lucky bastard.

The writer formerly known as This White Man Can Jump; Powah Stached; Bear Killer; Da Dude; The Other Bambino; TJ Dropped The Season; Harbaugh Is My Co-Pilot; Billick's Alter Ego; Mr. Poopy Pants.

by El.Dude on Oct 20, 2011 11:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, she sure is nice lol...

I could almost justify watching him for that reason.

by FrankWyt on Oct 20, 2011 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

It has been said all year long that Joe needs to out-perform other QB's if we want to win.

I.E Ben Rufflesburger and so on. In our 4 wins this year, Joe has outperformed each QB. Seems to me that he is getting the job done.

Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.

Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang

by Mr MaLoR on Oct 17, 2011 4:21 PM EDT reply actions  

no he’s not… ask me why

by Evan Skev on Oct 17, 2011 6:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

no

Obstacles are the things you see when you take your eyes off your goals.

by jackmca on Oct 17, 2011 7:55 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

Excellent Post Amp

As always. Very insightful.

Not top 5 QB, yet; but like I have always said, top 6 – 10 QB.

"A little learning is a dangerous thing; Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring."
"The difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightning and a lightning bug."
"God's whiskers! Your face is as hideous as the demon's in my storybook!"
"I never expected to see the day when girls would get sunburned in the places they do today."
"It's big for a reason."

For Pittsburgh fans, that's Pope, Twain, Rostand, Rogers and Megamind

by vlad755 on Oct 18, 2011 12:56 PM EDT reply actions  

It is a team thing entirely

As long as you have a D and a running Flacco doesn’t have to be elite. He just has to be what he is – pretty good and getting better. Now, in a few years your D may change and you will find that Reed and Ray are that replaceable. Logic would dictate that most likely their replacements might not be surefire HOF players. I would think that Flacco will need to become more consistant as the D has less ability to carry the load. But your young D players do really look pretty good and I don’t expect that much of a drop off when Ray and Reed retire in a couple of years or so. With Ozzie running things I think you will be one of the teams to beat for a while yet.

"If we always agree, one of us is not necessary"

by JUNGLEJOHN on Oct 19, 2011 12:19 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

With Ozzie running things I think you will be one of the teams to beat for a while yet.

Not sure how much longer Ozzie will be here, he is going to take over the Alabama athletic director job sooner or later. But we are setup with The Boy Genius, Eric DeCosta, to keep things rolling.

Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.

Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang

by Mr MaLoR on Oct 19, 2011 12:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Interesting

I wonder if a ring from Indy would accelerate The Wizard’s plans?

Talk about cred…

"A little learning is a dangerous thing; Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring."
"The difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightning and a lightning bug."
"God's whiskers! Your face is as hideous as the demon's in my storybook!"
"I never expected to see the day when girls would get sunburned in the places they do today."
"It's big for a reason."

For Pittsburgh fans, that's Pope, Twain, Rostand, Rogers and Megamind

by vlad755 on Oct 19, 2011 12:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

If we win it all this year, I could very well see Ozzie hanging it up.

Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.

Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang

by Mr MaLoR on Oct 19, 2011 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agree

I think he is going to stay a minimum of 4-5 year or a championship, whichever comes first.

So Alabama can expect Oz to be their AD sometime in February 2012.

by DT711 on Oct 19, 2011 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not sure how much longer Ozzie will be here, he is going to take over the Alabama athletic director job sooner or later.

Everyone keeps stating this as if it is a given. He is already 55 years old and has had a brilliant career on the field and as an executive. Why would he want to leave football and become an AD? An AD has to oversee every sport…football, basketball, baseball, lacrosse, soccer…etc etc etc, why would Ozzie want to do that at this point in his career? If anything, he will probably semi-retire from the Ravens and become a consultant or some other minor role for Alabama, but even that isn’t a guarantee.

by YeahDonnie on Oct 19, 2011 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ozzie is a god in Alabama. We don’t really see it because we are in MD, but those people are crazy over him and what he did/has done for that state. And if anyone loves their school, it is Ozzie Newsome. The man bleeds crimson, and where he started his football career, he may want to finish it there.

Yes, it is not definite, but I am sure it is an option he will strongly consider once his time with Baltimore is over.

Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.

Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang

by Mr MaLoR on Oct 19, 2011 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree with everything you said

but I still don’t see it happening, just my opinion. Too much responsibility, and it is a completely different job. I do see him helping recruit or being involved in some other way in the football program, but not AD.

by YeahDonnie on Oct 19, 2011 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Maybe so but he made these comments in 2009 - for what they're worth
This topic came up again, straight from Newsome.
“I am coming back,” Newsome said during a speech at the Eagle Luncheon put on by the Greater Alabama Council of the Boy Scouts of America. “I am coming back at some point. I have a lot of work to do in Baltimore, but I am coming back.”
Asked specifically whether he was referring to a particular job or just the desire to return to the state, Newsome said, “I am just coming back home.”

by DT711 on Oct 20, 2011 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

Malor,

Oz has never said he is going to take over the AD job at Alabama

by Evan Skev on Oct 22, 2011 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

From the outside

I’ve always thought the criticism of Flacco was ridiculous. The only thing that i thought could be said, is he had untimely int’s against the Steelers. But he’s a young guy. I don’t know where I’d rank him, but i believe he will continue improving, and if the Ravens don’t win the Super Bowl, I don’t think it would be him who is responsible for that

by FrankWyt on Oct 20, 2011 9:24 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Frank the Tank! Frank the Tank! Frank the Tank!

The writer formerly known as This White Man Can Jump; Powah Stached; Bear Killer; Da Dude; The Other Bambino; TJ Dropped The Season; Harbaugh Is My Co-Pilot; Billick's Alter Ego; Mr. Poopy Pants.

by El.Dude on Oct 20, 2011 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Frank Walker?

You come at the king, you best not miss.

by organizedchaos52 on Oct 21, 2011 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Old School reference

The writer formerly known as This White Man Can Jump; Powah Stached; Bear Killer; Da Dude; The Other Bambino; TJ Dropped The Season; Harbaugh Is My Co-Pilot; Billick's Alter Ego; Mr. Poopy Pants.

by El.Dude on Oct 21, 2011 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Got Old School from streaking.

But I also called Frank Walker “Frank the tank.” Perhaps I was alone in that.

You come at the king, you best not miss.

by organizedchaos52 on Oct 21, 2011 7:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Would you be

Referring to Frank Wycheck, the U of MD Alumnus?

"A little learning is a dangerous thing; Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring."
"The difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightning and a lightning bug."
"God's whiskers! Your face is as hideous as the demon's in my storybook!"
"I never expected to see the day when girls would get sunburned in the places they do today."
"It's big for a reason."

For Pittsburgh fans, that's Pope, Twain, Rostand, Rogers and Megamind

by vlad755 on Oct 21, 2011 10:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Frank Ricard.

that’s who the real Frank the Tank is
He is the one and only Frank the Tank.
I feel honored that El Dude referenced the real Frank the Tank while responding to me.

Ok, it’s not really that serious. But do you think KFC is still open?

by FrankWyt on Oct 22, 2011 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

Now what exactly does 41 stand for?

Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.

Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang

by Mr MaLoR on Oct 23, 2011 9:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

ha

Men and Football. The two greatest creations known to women!

by RedskinsGirl on Oct 25, 2011 4:46 PM EDT reply actions  

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