The favorites to make the 53 man roster
by Rayisyourdaddy on May 16, 2010 6:00 AM EDT
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PrintThis is all barring trades:
Bold Italics means the Starter, Bold means a lock, Parentheses means not a lock, Just Italics means Rookie Free Agent
Offense:
QB- Joe Flacco, John Beck, Troy Smith, Marc Bulger
RB- Ray Rice, Willis McGahee, (Jalen Parmale, Matt Lawrence, Curtis Steele)
FB- Le'Ron McClain, (Mike McLaughlin)
WR- Anquan Boldin, Derrick Mason, Donte Stallworth, (Mark Clayton, David Reed, Marcus Smith, Eron Riley, Demetrius Williams, Justin Harper)
TE- Todd Heap, Dennis Pitta, Ed Dickson, (Davon Drew)
OT- Michael Oher, Jared Gaither, Oniel Cousins, (Tony Moll, Stefan Rodgers, Ramon Harewood, Joe Reitz)
OG- Ben Grubbs, Marshal Yanda, Chris Chester
C- Matt Birk, David Hale
Defense:
DE- Haloti Ngata, Cory Redding, Trevor Pryce, Paul Kruger, (Lamar Divens, Arthur Jones)
DT- Kelly Gregg, Terrence Cody, (Brandon McKinney, Kelly Talavou)
ILB- Ray Lewis, Dannell Ellerbe, Tavares Gooden, Brendon Ayanbadejo, (Jason Phillips, Prescott Burgess)
OLB- Jarret Johnson, Terrell Suggs, Sergio Kindle, Antwan Barnes, (Jameel McClain, Edgar Jones, Albert McClellan)
CB- Domonique Foxworth, Chris Carr, Ladarius Webb, Fabian Washington, (Travis Fisher, Walt Harris, Cary Williams,Prince Miller)
S- Ed Reed, Dawan Landry, Haruki Nakamura, Tom Zbikowski, (KJ Gerard, Marcus Paschal, Ken Hamlin)
Special Teams:
K- Billy Cundiff or Shayne Graham
P- Sam Koch
Long Snapper: Matt Katula or Morgan Cox
Locks: 45 (Did not include Webb and Ed Reed, who will likely start on the PUP list)
Out of 80 players, there are 43 locks. That means the remaining 36 players are battling it out for 9 spots, although some players will make the practice squad. I will only discuss the practice squad to discuss player who I think will for sure be on it to start the year, like Ramon Harewood. Others, like Ladarius Webb, and likely Ed Reed will likely start on the PUP list opening up one additional spot.
I will start out by addressing how many of the remaining spots will be filled at specific positions. After the locks, we still have holes at CB, WR, FB, #3 RB, and need more depth on the O-line. So assuming McLaughlin makes it at FB, we keep 2/3 of the backup QB's, Hamlin instead of Reed, and a #3 RB, that leaves 7 spots for the remaining players. We are left with:
7 SPOTS for 20 PLAYERS!
I guarantee that we will have teams bidding for many of our castoffs, albeit with late round draft picks. Players like Antwan Barnes and Jameel McClain will likely garner much interest.
21 players: WR: (Marcus Smith, Mark Clayton, Demetrius Williams, Justin Harper, David Reed, Eron Riley), DB: (Travis Fisher, Walt Harris, Cary Williams, Prince Miller, KJ Gerard), DL: (Brandon McKinney, Kelly Talavou, Lamar Divens, Arthur Jones) LB: (Antwan Barnes, Edgar Jones, Jameel McClain, Jason Phillips) Tony Moll, and Davon Drew .
So out of the remaining 8 spots, my guesses are we keep: 2 LB, 1 DL, 2 CB, 2 WR . This leaves out O-line, which I believe we need to carry one more player, but do not see the caliber of player at that position that would make this roster. I fully expect us to trade from our WR and LB depth this pre-season in order to bolster our other positions and pick up some draft picks instead of losing players for nothing.
2 LB: Barnes, McClain (If we trade one of them then Phillips)
1 DL: Hoping for Arthur Jones, but McKinney, Divens and Talavou or valuable depth that other teams will want
2 CB: Likely one of the veterans (Fisher or Harris), and 1 youngster (hopefully Cary Williams, but could be Miller)
2 WR: Hopefully Clayton will be one of them, and I am rooting for David Reed. I think we can stash Marcus Smith on the PS until someone gets injured.
The opinions posted here are those of the administrator of this blog and his loyal readers. They are in no way official comments from the team, and should not be misconstued as such, even though he thinks he could do just as well or even a better job!
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I agree with your analysis
Keeping 6 WRs is crazy since it would negate depth at another position. My guess is someone from that group has a mysterious injury after the last pre-season game and goes on IR. If I had to guess a trade – and I’ve said this before – Mark Clayton is the WR with the most value. Although I love the thought of him in a 4 WR set, his salary does make him expendable. And Oz would jump on any offer for Demitrius Williams.
You can pick from the list of DL/LB where we’re loaded, and as Ray shows, we just can’t keep them all. So it’s a matter of which player another team values out of that group of almost interchangeable parts.
Potential candidates: Tavaris Gooden, Brandon McKinney, Antwan Barnes, Jameel McClain, Prescott Burgess, Jason Phillips.
"What we've got here is failure to communicate."
It's all about Special Teams
The guys on the bubble will either make this team or not based on their Special Teams’ abilities. Otherwise, look at an 8-man Practice Squad or buh-bye.
aka 'Rexx'
Bruce
Special Teams is a factor, but if it comes down to 2 players who contribute on ST, like McClain and Marcus Smith, who do you choose? It is looking like Edgar Jones will not make the roster at all. I fully expect either McClain or Barnes to be traded, and at least 1 WR to be traded for a late round pick.
My Take
The easy: I agree with you about the three QB’s, the three ST’ers (K, P, LS), two FB’s, two centers, the four guards (especially since Chester is really a G-C) and the four DE’s. I think we will keep three RB’s and DT’s: Rice, McGaHee plus one other; Gregg, Cody plus one other, respectively. My OT’s are the same as yours: the top three plus one other. I keep your top four OLB’s. I keep the same top four safeties as you. I think because of the injury situation we keep five DB’s: your top four plus one other. That is a total of 41 so far.
Differences: I think we only keep three TE’s: Heap and the rookies. Drew makes this top three only if somebody gets injured during camp or it is obvious one of the rookies is a bust. Otherwise Drew is on the taxi squad. Total of 44.
That leaves 9 slots for WR’s and ILB’s. I think we need to keep 4 ILB’s which means five WR’s. Even though I posted in the “6 WR” thread, I am beginning to re-think my position on that. WR’s have to be Boldin, Mason, Stallworth, Clayton (for insurance plus Clayton as the #3/#4 is fine) and… D. Williams unless someone else knocks him off from his “stranglehold” on the #5 spot… /sarcasm.
ILB is kind of tough for me: Ray Lewis, Ellerbe and then two others -I really do not have a good feel for these guys beyond the two obvious ones.
And that is 53.
Invariably there will be at least on injury during camp which will promote somebody unexpected. Also, there is good chance that some other team will release somebody unexpected that the Ravens will covet, which means they will have to free up a roster spot which means: do the Ravens just keep one FB? Do they just keep four CB’s, even with the injuries? Do they cut an offensive lineman? I think they may have to do at least on of these in order to keep Parmalee on the roster as I do not think we can Practice Squad him (not sure about the NFL rules on that due to his experience). Plus, I am not sure Parmalee would clear waivers if we did try to stash him on our practice squad.
What happens if a good, veteran, stop-gap CB lands in our laps? Hopefully it will have been through a trade to help clear the log-jam at WR and/or LB… In many ways, the argument for/against Clayton comes down to this, given the roster numbers (and a willing trade participant): which would you rather have, a proven albeit flawed NFL receiver as your #3/#4 and as an insurance policy for Bolding and Mason, or a decent veteran stop-gap starting CB for a few games who will be relegated to nickel or dime back once Webb and Washington are healed? Tough call…
Mt first “cut” at the practice squad assuming no injuries and experience holds: Drew, Gerard, some CB, some two WR’s, a LB, somebody from above so that Parmalee is on the opening day roster plus one other -possible Harewood.
One last thing about Harewood: I would not be surprised if the the Raven’s PUP him, see how his injury progresses, and see who else gets injured, and unless we desperately need him, he ends up getting IR’d for the year.
I agree there is a log-jam at LB and WR. Feels weird saying this, but other teams may be looking at our WR’s to see who we cut… And of course teams are always looking to see which LB leftovers they can scrounge from us.
I agree that if the Ravens can swing a deal for some of WR’s and LB’s, they do it to try to clear the log-jam.
Nice comment man. I agree with about everything except this,
One last thing about Harewood: I would not be surprised if the the Raven’s PUP him, see how his injury progresses, and see who else gets injured, and unless we desperately need him, he ends up getting IR’d for the year.
Harewood got hurt during mini camp and it was only an injury that takes 3-4 weeks to recover from, he is not done for the year whatsoever. He will definitely be battling during training camp and I do not think it would be a bad idea to keep him and Cousins for back-up tackle spots. Both guys can play Guard as well.
For MLB, I would say Ray, Ellerbeast, BA and Gooden. Not so sure what we want to do with Phillips yet, but maybe put him on P-Squad. I am however unsure of where BA fits as a LB. Might be too thin for MLB but is not really a pass rusher to be a OLB. But I do like when he is on the field, one of the best athletes on this team by far and a smart veteran.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
I might be putting words into vlad775’s mouth, but I think he was suggesting that we hide Harewood on IR this year while he spends some time developing.
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
I thought he was saying that. Just was not too sure. Wouldn’t be a bad idea. However, if a Gaither deal does happen then I think Harewood makes the 53.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
guys dont practice on IR, nor PUP
he wouldn’t be developing, he’d be atrophying. Nobody develops on IR.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Yes
To amp, I was thinking that.
There are two types of IR (unofficial). There is the first type which is basically you are wheelchair bound and a vegetable, due to a legitimate injury, and are just a big pile of carbon material collecting game checks for sucking up oxygen and spewing forth carbon dioxide; then there is the other type, made famous by Joe Gibbs, where you have some “injury” i.e. non-descriptive hip, finger, abdomen, foot (was always good one), etc. So yes, you are not “practicing”, but you are “re-habing” (working out) going to meetings (getting coached, etc.) and since Harewood is an admitted project, a year being on “IR” might not be such a bad thing.
Besides, I only floated it out as a possibility. If his injury is really only minor and no one else gets injured, then he lands on the Taxi Squad for this year. I am not ready to give him a roster spot yet due to him being a development project unless we are just decimated by injuries.
Vlad
Your analysis is right on. I however did not count Drew, I do not think we carry him on the active roster, hopefully he can make it back onto the practice squad. Next year if the rookie TE’s have good years, maybe we can waive Heap and finally bring Drew onto the active roster.
I think we start the season with 4 CB plus Fabian Washington. Whenever Fabian is back from his injury that will give us 5. It is looking like the 4 will be Carr, Foxworth, Fisher and Cary Williams. If for some reason we do not sign Fisher, we will have to find someone else to fill that spot.
At ILB, it is an easy call for who is the 3rd one on the roster, and that is Brendon Ayanbedejo. He is an amazing ST player who is very good on passing downs. The other options are Gooden, who looks like a bust overall in my opinion and gets injured alot, and Phillips who was a very good college player who we liked alot in the draft who was injured for his rookie year and has not shown anything. I like his upside more than Gooden’s, so I think we should cut our losses with him personally. Also, it is possible we will not go into the season with more than 3 ILB, cuz there has been talk of JJ sliding inside on passing downs to get Kindle in there as an OLB, plus we play the 4-3 sometimes which only requires 1 ILB, so we might carry an extra OLB instead, or maybe a guy like McClain who can play both spots as the 4th guy.
My trading block: Clayton, Barnes, and our DT depth (Talavou, McKinney, Divens)
Ron Tepper will now call you on the phone begging for all 5 of those players.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
BA
I think the reason I am having a hard time evaluating BA is because he was injured for a good amount of the season last year (in the regular season against New England, I think) and he is still not out of the woods yet:
I agree that he does give us a lot, when healthy. I know he was never injured prior to this, but this one seems rather severe.
For your CB’s (Carr, Foxworth, Fisher, C. Williams plus Washington) what about Webb? Are you IR’ing him and writing him off for the season (which could very well happen)? Did we just trade him to Al Davis for Nnamdi Asomugha and Heyward-Bey and I didn’t hear about it?
Yes, I see your points about our ILB’s and our LB’s in general. Regardless of whether JJ stays outside, slides inside, or goes sideways, I think we keep eight LB’s in some fashion. We are very deep at LB, and LB’s are the heart and soul of our ST’s.
Webb will get PUP probably, so he will not be able to play the first 6 weeks, which is not too bad. I would rather him come back after week 6 then to risk him right from week 1.
I think we HAVE to keep 6 CB’s. I am getting sick and tired of Corey Ivy and Frank Walker starting at CB in the playoffs the alst two years (and yes, that did happen). Fisher could be a steal for us. Jimmy Leonhard 2.0 at CB anyone?
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
Troy Smith
Meant to add this to your trading block. I believe Troy Smith is shrink wrapped and ready to be sold to the first decent offer that comes along. Third rounder, anybody? A better than average CB?
No one will give up more than a 5th round pick for him. He has done nothing to improve his stock since coming in the league, and he was a 5th round pick. I think with the Fisher signing, we just hold onto Troy for this year. I LOVE Smith as our #2. Beck has no swag, Troy does.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
He has done nothing to improve his stock since coming in the league…
Did it hurt to type that?
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
I Missed the Boat
I must be missing something because Troy Smith has won an NFL game as a starting quarterback. Sporadic career numbers, but what is functional equivalent to roughly three games, he has an 80 QB rating with 54% completion percentage (OK, only middlin’ numbers, but he is young), 1-1 as a starter, 3 TD’s to 1 Int +2 FL (better than Boller’s TD to TO ratio), what is not to like?
Yes, I do also like Troy as our #2, but I would not loose any sleep if he was no longer a Raven. (now Gaither, on the other hand… -just said that to poke a dead horse with a sharp stick)
Are you telling me nobody is going to come to the realization that what they currently have is just aweful, or are decimated by injuries that Ozzie does not get a late camp phone call inquiring about Troy’s services? For more than a fifth rounder or decent CB?
swag? What is that? Beck has no swag. If I were starting a new football team I would take Beck over Smith. Beck has a better chance to be a NFL starter in this league than does Smith. He is very talented, makes all the throws, passes in this offense but lacks consistency. If “swag” means run, then I understand.
"We don't report the murders just the beatings!"
I’m pretty sure Cam drafted Beck specifically because of his low-swag content.
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
Swag means Swaggggggg. I look at Beck and see a choke artist. Just like my philosophy with kickers, I do not like his face.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
faces are important. Flacco passed my face test early.
I’m swagg… SURFIN… Old school Chevrolet… PERFECT.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
do you want your 2nd string (5th rd. QB) walking around with SWaggggggg. Looking cool and bee-bopping. Until he throws that pick 6 and then what back to hanging his head?
"We don't report the murders just the beatings!"
Beck led a 1-15 team. Troy actually has some wins under him and some stats as well.
This is basically me towards Beck and some other kickers. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3lGKMXYOG8
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
almost out of gas...
CALL THE AY-RABS!!!
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
I like Smith and all that, but Beck didn’t lead the 1-15 team. They went 1-15 because every quaterback that the had was injured… including Beck. He only started 4 games that year, and they were 0-9 before he even stepped on the field.
how dare you underestimate the swag. you must not have any
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Exactly. Swag was one of the reasons Suggs said he wanted Troy to start 3 years ago.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
swagg is everything always and everywhere. you can get a house with swagg, even if your credit score is bad. Swagg can get you a job, even if your resume is bad (that’s actually true). Swagg is definitely a factor.
Soooo many guys have what John Beck has but were never good starters. Kyle Boller had all the measureables, and a really good last year of college. No swag. Rob Johnson was the reason Wade Phillips benched Doug Flutie despite the fact that Flutie looked great. But Rob had no swag. All the measurables, but no swag. I could go on, but I’d have to write a fanpost. If suddenly become less lazy, I will.
Bottom line, is there’s one way for fans to check a guy’s swag: his face. Tom Brady has the “I could bang your girl” swag. Brett Favre has the country-boy “I could kick your ass” swag. Joe Flacco has the “I will work harder than you and win games” swag. you can see some evidence of this in their faces. John Beck’s face? I dunno man, I think I gotta side with MaLoR’s “Step Brothers” reference.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
You and your face philosophy. Personally, I think that it’s a bunch of hog-wash.
I hope we sign Shayne Graham.
One of the worst faces in the NFL. Who wants a Frotch on their team that chokes in the playoffs?
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
nope, profile pictures don't give you "swag" indications.
only facial expressions during game situations. It’s like Vince Carter’s “I just got knocked-down” face versus Michael Jordan’s “I could slit your f-king throat right now but I’d rather just take you to the rim and kill your soul” face. It’s easier to spot in Basketball, because the court is small and you’re close to the players. But thanks to HD and NFL network and all the camera angles we get in the NFL, you can see their faces.
Tell me Steve Hauschka’s face wasn’t an indicator of how well he’d perform.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Tell me Steve Hauschka’s face wasn’t an indicator of how well he’d perform.
He was like 12 years old. Give him a chance to grow into his swag.
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
If you can find my comments during training camp last year when we had Gano and Hooshka on this team, you clearly see that I stated I hated Hooshka’s face and that he would be a bum. 100%.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
Oh brother!
Just because you’re right about one player (who everyone else was also skeptical of) means that your philosophy is verified? Shayne Graham is one of the best kickers in recent NFL history and is now a bum because he misses a few big, high-pressure kicks? Even the great Stover had his bad games and stretches of bad games. I’m still embarrassed about the Dolphins game. He had a chance to win if for us, but now we’ll always be remember as the one win for the 1-15 Dolphins.
Shayne Graham is one of the best kickers in recent NFL history and is now a bum because he misses a few big, high-pressure kicks?
Yup. He’s a bum. Just like that. Your kicker needs to hit pressure kicks, that’s what he’s there for. It totally changes how you play the game if you can’t trust him to do that. Now, with what we know about Shane Graham, we can’t trust him to hit pressure kicks.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
BAL_Hawk, if he was so great, then why would the Bengals not want to bring him back? Because he choked.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
I agree. He may actually be a bum. I was only yanking Malor’s chain when I said that we should sign him. Honestly, I don’t really know much about him.
I’m just saying that… even if he is a bum, it’s not because of his face.
yes but surely you agree...
if a guy has what my driver’s ed instructor referred to as “O-S Sydrome,” or a face that has “OH SHIT” written all over it, and then he shanks a pressure kick… it’s not a a coincidence.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
I'm dead serious. Don't call me rediculous, engage me with your "logic."
Facial expressions tell us about someone’s mentality, and someone’s mentality has a lot to do with how hard they will work and how well they will perform when it counts. If you’re a coach and you call timeout and a player rolls his eyes as he comes over to talk to you, do you discount that because of his college numbers? FACES MATTER.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Thank you! You can tell by a guys face if he is a winner. Hooshka is not a winner, and we all saw that.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
well... hold your horses
lots of guys have swag but lack talent. Swag can’t really buy you a house, like i exaggerated above. At some point, you actually need a good credit score…
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Freddie Mitchell was a prime example of too much Swag with too little talent. A disastrous combination.
yes,
our own Frank Walker is a prime example
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
he's a good player though
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
I told you that I agreed that there are intangibles. I also agree that a person can display their intangibles through facial expressions. However, I don’t believe that’s the sole indicator. How a person reacts to hardship in a real way and real life is a bigger indicator to me. Do they work harder or retreat into a shell? Facial expressions are indicators but they are FAR from being a definitive indicator.
I am admired that my sarcastic antics have caused such a discussion. Thank you fellas.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
Lol. Not alot of news in the off-season. Gotta look elsewhere for discussion. So how bout those Orioles? 1,200 people at the game yesterday, it was great.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
oh my God.
that’s horrible. I may just disown baseball as a sport…
I’m in Manaus, Amazonas now and I need to find a bar that will have the Boston game on tonight. I’m watching this game or bust. Add to that my GF’s family is mormon so while they say it’s ok for me to drink here, I don’t exactly feel completely at ease showing them just HOW MUCH I typically drink when watching sports… hmm….
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
never coming back...
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
It was cold, raining and a match-up of the two worst records in the MLB. Did you expect the place to be ever 25% full?
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
perhaps i'm naive
but I attended what was at the time the lowest attendance ever in Camden Yards history last year when we played Toronto and started Berken for the first time. The attendance was 3000 some-odd but I could swear i counted only 2,873.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
I don't expect it to be over 25% full when it's a nice day
Bringing Baltimore Beatdown "Create a Caption" for 6 weeks and counting.
by Zachary Beard on May 24, 2010 9:31 PM EDT up reply actions
by Boston game I meant Celtics game
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
i apologized below for jumping the gun on you
i hadn’t read what you wrote before where you partially agreedeth wif meh.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Swag and a good face are two qualities of “playing like a raven”
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
You also have to have been accused of a crime
Bringing Baltimore Beatdown "Create a Caption" for 6 weeks and counting.
by Zachary Beard on May 24, 2010 9:32 PM EDT up reply actions
my bad didnt see that you gave me some respect above. forgive my intransigence (i dont know what that word means but i used it anyway)
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
BA
Is a great fill in type player, really good on passing downs. Not a full time player ever, but great in a fill-in role. I think we should cut our losses with Gooden and see what we can get for him in trade. Then we see what Phillips can do in his spot. I don’t think it is much harder for someone to be better than Gooden, and if Phillips shows nothing, bring McClain into the season as the 4th ILb (plus JJ can play there).
About Troy, no one is giving more than a 6th rounder for him. He is more valuable to us than to anyone else. No one even sniffed around him with a 5th round tender. That says something.
At CB, we are fine coming into the season with 5, and since someone is bound to get injured, we will have Webb coming back from his injury a few weeks in. Worst comes to worst, we sign a stopgap until he is back. In a pinch we can use Nakamura there.
Cuz we don’t have enough edge rushers? Kindle, Barnes, Suggs, McClain, etc! Gooden is a fragile athlete who is decent, but got beaten out by an undrafted FA. I think if we can recoup a 4th rounder for him, we let him go. Just my opinion, but I don’t think he has shown anything in his first 2 years…
by Rayisyourdaddy on May 18, 2010 11:01 AM EDT reply actions
I think Gooden over McClain if we have to move him to the outside. Gooden’s frame and measurables make him look more like an OLB than ILB. McClain has done basically the same amout as Gooden to this point in his career, which really is nothing. Also BA’s injury is still lingering, we don’t know if he’ll be ready by the start of the season.
“looking like” an OLB is one thing but McClain actually has a couple of sacks for safeties, so I’ll take that over Gooden’s whole “looking like an OLB.” McClain also looks like he’s more durable too, which is definitely a major consideration when talking about backup plans who can play multiple positions
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
McClain
Has experience at both positions, as we slid him over last year.
by Rayisyourdaddy on May 18, 2010 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions
What did McClain do other than get two safeties,two years ago? I saw Gooden run down AP, and that was better athletisim then I’ve ever seen from McClain.
I never said he had to slide over yet anyway. I’m just not ready to give up on him yet
BA is still injured and we don’t know what we’re get from him. Trading away a freak athlete for a low round pick doesn’t make sense to me, especially when Ozzie always picks good LBs
I saw Gooden run down AP…
Was that the same play where Gooden let AP get into the secondary? If Gooden’s best plays are going to cost us that much yardage, I’m going to have to agree with jackmca (which typically pans out as the safe bet, anyways). Besides, how can you possibly downplay McClain’s safeties? How many people get two safeties in their rookie year?
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
I can down play them because that’s all I’ve seen him do in two years. I like McClain on special teams, but there’s a reason Gooden has played with the starters instead of him….. (hint: he’s more athletic and a better player)
Watch the game Minn. game again. He was on the other side of the line.
So with your arguement, you’re saying we should keep McClain over Gooden?
that's what he's saying
and it’s what I’m saying too. I remember watching Gooden all game long aginst Minny, and you’ll notice that when he couldn’t beat those blocks they put Ellerbe in there. Gooden just isn’t strong enough to play the Bart Scott position in our defense.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
In all honesty, it seems like Gooden would be better suited in Ray Lewis’ position. That MLB position has always seemed to be the speedy LB spot, and I think we can all agree that Gooden is the fastest LB on the team. But that is not saying Gooden should start over Lewis obviously. I agree about the strength part. Ellerbe is stronger and when teams game plan to run away from Ray Lewis, you better be prepared to have the ball coming at the other MLB spot. Ellerbe did that better than Gooden.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
barnes might be faster than gooden
but who knows. i think you’re right though about the different ILB positions though.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
furthermore
we’re talking about possible the LAST linebacker roster spot on the team. You need such a player to be a utility player who can fill multiple roles due to the unpredictable nature of injuries. McClain fits that bill much better than Gooden.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
McClain fits that bill much better than Gooden.
I agree. McClain can and has lined up at nearly every LB position since his time with us, hasn’t had nearly as many injury problems as Gooden has had and done a pretty good job for us. His rookie season was great to see. 2 sacks and 2 safeties. I would keep McClain over Gooden also. But then I would have no clue what to do with the custom made Gooden jersey I bought last year, thinking he would be an all-pro.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
Players can switch postions easiar than you’re giving them credit for. If McClain was the better player he would have got the starts over Gooden.
Gooden was a draft pick
so that earns him some chances on Sundays while McClain has to earn all of his. I think McClain is actually better than Gooden at this point, and I suspect the FO does too. He has the proper size and stregnth to stack blocks and hit fullbacks, whereas Gooden got manhandled far too often for my liking.
Plenty of players start over other players but it doesn’t mean that they’re better for the rest of eternity. I think now that Ellerbe seems to have cemented his role as the starter at ILB, you have to wonder where Gooden stands with Ozzie and Harbaugh.
Given his speed, you may be right that they’ll convert him to a gunner on ST, but my personal take is to keep McClain
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Ellerbe does not have MLB2 locked up
Harbaugh said it is an open competition!
by Rayisyourdaddy on May 28, 2010 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Harbaugh also said that Hauschka was going to be a very, very good kicker in this league. Let’s not buy into everything he says. SHOVELS AND SWORDS FOR LIFE!
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
You did it MaLoR.
And how did you do it? With toughness, and grit! Like I knew you had! With a shoven in one hand, and a sword in the other!
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Grits. The breakfast of champions. What do we feed our players every morning? Grits. Sometimes gravy. I want my players to be like squirrels. Because what do squirrels do? The KEEP DIGGING! And that’s what we are. Not lions, not tigers, we are squirrels. Squirrels with integrity.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
biggest thing for me...
Gooden gets injured, McClain seems more durable. that’s the first thing you need out of your depth players.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
I agree. McClain is a much better prospect for a 3-4 OLB. Gooden just isn’t physical enough.
Gooden is strictly a weak inside linebacker in the 3-4. I actually think that he’d make a better 4-3 OLB.
Maybe he could have a career as a ST ace (and situational LB) if he works at it, ala Brenden Ayanbedajo.
he gets hurt
too much in open space, he is not thick enough!
by Rayisyourdaddy on May 20, 2010 9:50 PM EDT up reply actions
John Beck QB, 3rd on the depth chart
2007 Beck was drafted 40th pick overall in the 2nd rd. out of BYU by Cam Cameron and the Dolphins. Started his rookie season as a 3rd string, was promoted to 2nd string in week 6. By week 11 he was the starter. Beck only started 4 games that year. He was 60 for 107 with 559 yds., 3 int. and 1 TD but he was sacked ‘10’ times. The offensive line was horrible and the defense was just as bad. Peyton Manning wouldn’t have won starting on that team. Beck started and lost to the Eagles and Steelers and he may have won the game against the Ravens (i’m not sure). In 2008 the Dolphins brought in Bill Parcells and he promptly signed Josh McCown and Chad Pennington ( which I would like to personally say thanks to-because Parcells fired Cam Cameron) and the Dolphins released John Beck.
at BYU John Beck stats are;
2005 331 for 513 3709yds. 27TDs 13int.
2006 289 for 417 3885yds. 32TDs 8int.
2005 BYU MVP.
2006 Sporting News All-American and John Unitas Golden Arm Award Finalist.
and that’s fine if you like Troy Smith over Beck, I just happen to think Beck has more potential to be an NFL QB then Troy does. We’ll agree to disagree.
"We don't report the murders just the beatings!"
I know one stat that is more impressive than all those.
Troy Smith, Heisman Trophy Winner.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
So did Charlie Ward.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
isn't it obvious?
I don’t have a point. I just wanted to add on another random Heisman name.
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Tim Tebow
… just adding to the long (very long) list of Heisman Trophy winning QB’s who never cut it in the NFL.
"What we've got here is failure to communicate."
don't count him out yet
"Cam, we're not going to have any issues because we're going to be winning."
--Joe Flacco
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
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