Ravens Training Camp Battles: Tight Ends
by Bruce Raffel on Jul 13, 2009 9:53 AM EDT
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PrintAfter former Raven QB and NFL star Steve McNair was laid to rest Saturday, I say it's time to let the man rest in peace and move on to re-focusing on the game itself. BaltimoreRavens.com did an interesting story written by Geoff Peckham, on the competition between the tight ends. Check out the story by clicking here.
I thought this would be a great topic to debate, especially the chances of who will step up other than starter Todd Heap. Heap is coming off of a downyear, but many people withhold blaming it on him, instead making the case that he was forced to stay in on passing downs to provide additional protection for rookie QB Joe Flacco. That should change this season, as the offensive line made great strides last year and looks to be one of the strong points of this year's offense. However, I'm somewhat skeptical of that reasoning, as he did seem to drop a few passes that he normally does hold onto. At the same time, the incredible catch he made in traffic in Tennessee towards the end of the game winning drive that culminated in Matt Stover's 43 yard FG to put us in the AFC Championship Game was classic Heap.
So who represents the next best option after Heap, or in addition to him?
The Ravens second string tight end the past few years, Daniel Wilcox is now gone. Quinn Sypniewski was thought to move into the backup slot and was a solid blocker and surprisingly decent pass catcher. However, Sypniewski has been injury prone and while it looked like he was on his way to recovery and starting the season as the team's second string TE, he was forced to undergo another surgery that could either sideline him a good portion of the 2009 season or even cause him to miss it entirely.
That was the main reason the Ravens went out and signed former Philadelphia Eagle LJ Smith to a contract in the off season. Smith, who was Eagles' QB Donovan McNabb's main target at the tight end position, is very athletic for the position, with good speed but suspect hands. According to many Eagles' fans, he'll make the tough grabs but drop the balls that hit him in the hands in the key situations, which frustrated fans enough to say they won't miss him in 2009. The Eagles "trash" could be the Ravens "treasure," as they plan to use Smith in two TE sets as well in multiple passing formations and expect him to contribute right away.
Drafted in the 5th round in this year's NFL Draft, Davon Drew (East Carolina) poses some interesting options for the Ravens. He has good size (6'4", 260 lbs.) and good enough hands (43 receptions for 695 yards in 2008) to be named All Conference USA honors his final two years in school. Drew could be an excellent insurance policy for Sypniewski if his recovery is delayed or interrupted.
The Ravens moved LB/DE Edgar Jones around last year, based on their needs each game. Some were at his natural position on the defensive side of the ball, but other times, he was forced onto the offensive side as a reserve tight end. Although he only caught one pass last year, he proved his versatility by playing defense and Special Teams and will continue to be a valuable Wild Card in 2009 wherever he is utilized.
Finally, there is little known about Isaac Smolko, who was an undrafted free agent in 2008 out of Penn State University. At 6'5", 258 lbs., Smolko is a big target but did not have any receptions in his rookie year last season, with minimal playing. For him to make the team, it will be due to his play on Special Teams, as he is buried deep on the TE depth chart.
The Ravens report to Training Camp in Westminster, Maryland in less than three weeks and the TE position will be closely watched by all to see how they stack up to play in the 2009 season that is finally getting closer and closer.
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Davon Drew will emerge...
…as the next Antonio Gates with 76 receptions for 1100 yards and 7 touchdowns this year. It has been forseen…
Yea
And Joe Flacco actually has 2 eye brows. Be real.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
yeah... you're right...
…the real, non-joking prediction is that we get some total in the range of 800 yards out of all of our tight ends combined. There will probably be a revolving door there with Drew, Smith, and Heap all getting playing time and trading injuries.
I would love to see him explode like that.
Don’t get me wrong, who wouldn’t? But they only way he would even come close to seeing playing time like that is if Todd and LJ go down. But, that is a very good possibility. Heap gets hurt taking a shower and LJ sprains his right big toe nail. Drew steps in and all is forgotten of the stomrin mormin.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
Reading comprehension is your friend
the real, non-joking prediction is that we get some total in the range of 800 yards out of all of our tight ends combined
I am aware he stated that
My reply was geared more towards the first comment Jackmca left.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
The X-Factor
I think we can expect only a little more production out of Heap/Smith this year over last year’s Heap production and here are the reasons why:
1) While it will not be called as often, I still see a lot of “Max Protect” calls the first four to six games of the season, which means very little receptions out of the TE’s.
2) Heap is another year older, I do not believe he is 100% healthy, I think the years and injuries have taken a toll on him; I think he has lost a step; before he might might have had that extra half step on the LB or safety covering him, I do not think he has that anymore, which going to decrease his receptions.
3) At this stage in his career, I do not see much difference between Smith and Heap in terms of production. With Smith’s injury bug, does anybody expect much more than an average of two catches and twenty-five yards a game over sixteen games for Smith? I think Smith is an “old” 29, and his best two years he averaged about 3.5 catches and forty yards a game and that was with McNabb throwing to him!
Maybe the injuries that have plagued both Heap and Smith are due to wearing down and two many snaps. I guess with both of them, they each maybe only have to be on the field for 50% – 60% of the snaps versus 90% of the snaps in the past. If that is the case, and between the two of them they can average four to five catches for sixty to seventy yards per game (total) over a sixteen game game season and still have something in the tank for the playoffs, then Hallelujah! As a comparison, Sharpe averaged four catches and fifty yards per game the two years he was here, and Heap during his three best years averaged a few more yards and a half catch more a game than Sharpe. But I am reticent to devote two valuable roster spots to one position.
Now, the X-factor: if there was ever a position that could be had at some point over the course of the season, it is starting TE. Yes, barring injury, the Ravens are going to start the season with the Heap-Smith Tango. But if Edgar Jones or Drew start to light it up, the Ravens will have to play them. I especially like Jones’s size: 6-3, 280+ which means he can stay in and block (if he improves his technique) and is a nice sized target for Flacco. Drew is probably more of a receiving TE than blocking, but if catches fire, then he could be the starter for the next ten years…
Contrary to what Harbaugh states publicly, I think everybody knows Heap’s and Smith’s best, and most individually productive years are behind them.
Well sai
I agree that Heap and Smith’s best years are behind them. I also think that Sypniewski may not see the field again in a purple jersey. Smolko is pretty much here to help the firt team defense practice and special teams), while Drew is the x-factor in my mind. Expect Heap to get the most touches and Smith to get the reps in his place. Other than that, I’m not sold on Jones being anything other than a big body to block but Drew could pan out and be a decent contributor.
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Jul 13, 2009 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Syp?
I agree: I believe at some point in the near future, he gets released from the Ravens via an injury settlement. Not that Stevie-B is a tight-wad, but how long is he suppose to pay a guy to continually re-hab? What has he earned over his career: like a million bucks per actual football caught? At some point, the powers to be have to arrive at the conclusion, you know, it was just not meant to be with Syp and the Ravens. I am by no means throwing Syp under the bus, it is just the facts of life in the NFL.
Who knows, after he is released, Syp takes a year off, really heals up and then returns to some other team to have a respectable NFL career -more power to him. Unless Syp is really projected to be the next Ozzie Newsome, I say let’s cut our loses and move on…
very true...
…sometimes great guys with great stuff just never make it in the NFL. It’s not the GM’s job to feel sorry for him or to coach him on his next career move. it’s the GM’s job to evaluate whether or not he can contribute as a member of the team. If a player’s lack of contribution is due to factors beyond his control—an illness or injury— it may be unfortunate for that player but it doesn’t change the simple fact that he rarely contributes.
And Demetrius Williams is on notice for this too. He certainly didn’t intentionally IR himself, and it would be sad to see such a natural athlete go by the wayside due to circumstances beyond his control, but he needs to be productive this year in order to give anybody a reason to sign him.
You don’t get paid to get hurt and have a pity party. You get paid to play.
I can't wait to see
those twin tight end formations with two huge guys in LJ Smith and Todd Heap.. That play action should be so effective this year
Derrick Mason Retires….
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/07/13/ravens-wide-receiver-derrick-mason-retires/
I'll drink your Milkshake, I'll drink it up!
by Frank Mineo (DYMS) on Jul 13, 2009 5:42 PM EDT reply actions
I thought you were joking at first
Then I see it on ESPN. So random. GO FRONT OFFICE!
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
Don't be so quick to blame anyone at The Castle
More than likely, this is a cause-and-effect from his buddy McNair’s life altering epiphany!
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Jul 13, 2009 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions
His public comments
seem to agree with Bruce. His career-long friend just died tragically. If that doesn’t make you refocus your priorities, I don’t know what will. His words were that he’s made more than enough money in his career, and it’s time to put his heart into something else other than football. I suspect he realized what he played through last season, and he didn’t want to risk his health again in the light of what happened to McNair.
On the first day, Chuck Norris created God. But the day before that, Matt Wieters created Chuck Norris and the calendar.
by oriolesfan151 on Jul 13, 2009 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions
BUT with Mason retiring
You have to expect that Heap steps up or is shown the door. I don’t know when his contract is up, but you can expect that he won’t be back if he can’t put up some numbers this season. The lack of notice that Mason gave us is more than a little bit crippling. But because of that, it gives Heap an opportunity to get going in the passing game, possibly line up in the slot like the good ol’ days.
That said, I’d expect to see Drew get some opportunities, but I’d really like to see Quinn Sypniewski step up and get some reps. It hurt to see him get knocked out last season, but he seemed to show shakes of Todd Heap when he became #1 on the depth chart. He’s definitely got some sticky hands, and I believe he’s only a third year player, second if you discount last year’s stint on IR.
On the first day, Chuck Norris created God. But the day before that, Matt Wieters created Chuck Norris and the calendar.
Syp is hurt
and it doesn’t look good for not only the season, but his career as well.
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Jul 14, 2009 9:15 AM EDT up reply actions
= (
i thought I’d heard that he was hurt, so I checked up on it via the team report on Yahoo. Go figure that they didn’t have him listed anywhere that has to do with injuries, only a resigning.
With that being said, Drew has to be the one to step up. L.J. Smith was good in Philadelphia, but Philly had a legitimate outside passing attack. When you open up the outside like McNabb and his receiving corps can, you take guys out of the box, you leave the tight ends with more separation and play-making space. He’ll be good, but he won’t be as good.
I guess we just send up a few prayers that Todd Heap shakes this drought he’s been in. He’s such a big guy that when he goes up for balls, it’s easy for the quarterback to throw it in a place where he gets hung out to dry. He either gets tougher and makes some catches this year, or we’ll need a miracle out of #1 Clayton and #2 Williams shudder.
On the first day, Chuck Norris created God. But the day before that, Matt Wieters created Chuck Norris and the calendar.
by oriolesfan151 on Jul 14, 2009 9:30 AM EDT up reply actions
Reading your posts is like watching a Mexican soap opera. iQue teatro!
Water covers 2/3 of the Earth's surface. Ed Reed covers the rest.
hahahahah
dudes seriously, mason retiring doesn’t kill our season. it’l just be another really hard test for Joe Flacco, which is all he’s had to deal with thus far. Sure, it weakens our offense in the short term, but this day was bound to happen with Mason. Perhaps its better to put the onus on the front office now to develop/acquire more talent to put around Joe Flacco.
Ozzie adding talent around Joe?
That would be something new. Ozzie does not like to pay Offensive players. He thinks that improving the defense is going to keep Flacco from a sophomore slump.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
Yea, that was a surprise.
Can’t believe Ozzie gave him 40 million. But with WR, hell no. We will never pay for one and will keep drafting the Travis Taylors and 2nd day guys in hopes that they will be good. We do not go after proven WR, just not our style.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
raven?
Did yoyu steal MaLoR’s identity and take over with that negative attitude? where will you be when we win the Super Bowl with this rag-tag group of receivers?
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Jul 14, 2009 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Be right here supporting them 100%. As much as I hate this situation, I am going to be forced into liking it.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
Trust me
you wil end up impressed, as they in The Castle are MUCH better at this than we are.
Not so for those in The Warehouse on Camden Street though.
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Jul 15, 2009 8:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Jones adds nothing
He’s not a possession receiver, has suspect hands and can only outjump others for a catch. No great speed running routes and is not anywhere near an upgrade over what we already have in camp.
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Jul 14, 2009 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions
what Matt Jones have you been watching?
He absolutely is a posession receiver, he had over 800 yards last year in only 12 games. he was very productive, and shows excellent speed. His overall athleticism is freakish in just about every aspect, and he’s buff at 240 lbs. Aside from the coke thing, there really isn’t much to dislike. His ceiling is very high.
'scuse me, Jones only had 761 yards.
and there were also 9 games with 5 or more receptions. if’ that’s not an upgrade over our other guys, I’m not sure what is.
The main gameplay knock on him is that he doesn’t seem totally fluid in and out of his cuts, but that’s not an uncurable ailment. We can get him super-cheapo, I see no reason not to.
Character man
I heard he once stole a lolly pop from a 711 and also would not share his transformers with his little brother. That is some terrible Character. Ozzie will never pick him up.
Gotta live a perfect lifestyle to be a Raven. Even though Ray Lewis was in a murder situation and Jamal Lewis was dealing cocaine.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
which is exactly why I'm not so sure you have the "character" policy right
Apparently they’re willing to let a few character issues slide if they think a player is good enough. So then, the question would be, is Jones good enough? They might not think so, I’m just saying that I do.
Marshall is good enough
T.O is good enough. Boldin is good enough.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
T.O.??????
Have to respectfully disagree. Boldin, yes, I agree. T.O. no way, no how, not in this lifetime. How many rings does T.O. have? How many bodies has T.O left in his wake, figuratively speaking of course? There is not scenario imaginable where T.O. is or should even be a Raven -just to much negativity and downside with that one.
I will say this, I am always willing to give someone a second, third, fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh chance, on someone else’s dime of course :) If T.O cleans up his act in Buffalo, and does not leave a hurricane strewn mess in his wake, then, and only then would I consider him. But by that point age may be a factor. Moss is an example of someone that I really did not want, but he then proved himself in NE and it appears given the right circumstances, he can be a positive influence. Not a saint, but not a pox either.
I would have welcomed T.O. here
But that is just me.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
Listen:
If we sign Mat Jones, I’m instantly in his corner. I bleed Ravens purple and support all our guys. However, he is not what we need. We talk about strtching the field and if Clayton fills the “Mason” role, then will Matt
Jones fill the “stretching the field” role? No. D-Will or Marcus will do that, but not Jones. Not ready to trad ein Clayton for Matt Jones, as Mark knows the system and just needs Flacco to look for him more often now.
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Jul 14, 2009 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions
ummmmm...
Jones is definitely a burner on fly routes and stretches the field as well as many in the AFC. And seeing as we only have one good starting WR and need two, I’m not suggesting dumping Clayton for Jones. I’m saying let them play together.
Fine, then if it will make you feel better
I’ll tell Ozzie to bring him in for a talk and a physical then let him run down some tosses from Joe. Will that make you happy?
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Jul 15, 2009 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t have a bad attitude Rexx (lol) and MaLor is right! We’ve ignored the receiver position for years. We haven’t developed a young guy in this role. Out of all the receivers we’ve brought in, Ozzie could have groomed a couple wouldn’t you think. I mean, we held onto Travis Taylor for years. That was crazy. Before Mason, you have to go back to Michael Jackson, Turner and Alexander to find a fair one. Ismail helped. It’s been a while. I will stop arguing this point and put my faith in Marcus Smith. We will see.
I am just ready for change
You have a QB who can throw it like no other and our best WR would be a #3 on half the teams in the league. We need to stop being pussies and take a risk at a guy who can play ball in this league. Boller was horrible and could have maybe been better had his best WR not been Randy Hymes and Marcus Robinson.
Give me Marshall or Boldin and shut me up.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
Anthony Wright
did okay w/ Marcus Robinson….
….for one game!
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Jul 15, 2009 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions
9th greatest comeback in league history, according to NFL Network.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
and I missed that game
sitting at home recovering from ACL surgery.
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Jul 18, 2009 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions
i missed that game. and also gave my nephew the tickets to Jamals record game against cleveland. my biggest regrets.
how can you measure a QB if you give him little to know help in the receiver department. the fact that flacco was able to get mason the ball so much last year is awesome. those two battled through predictable plays. the world new what was coming. very sad to see mason go. i think he is moving to the Neverland Ranch and taking Michaels place on the tour.
Davon Drew should be our starting TE. I have a good feeling about this guy and I like the ECU players. They are nasty.
Where was ags QB David Garrard from?
Isn’t that also ECU?
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Jul 18, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions
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