Winning, Regardless of How, Still Beats Losing
by Bruce Raffel on Nov 30, 2009 10:37 AM EST
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PrintPrior to last nights 20-17 overtime victory over the Pittsburgh Steelers, the Baltimore Ravens had lost five of their last seven games, some of them in classic 2009 Ravens' frustrating fashion. Therefore, winning a game, any game, much less one over their hated AFC North division rivals, feels pretty good by my standards.
Even without their top offensive and defensive players, Pittsburgh is still a tough team and played well enough to keep the game close and even had a chance to win it in the extra session. But the Ravens, faced with certain elimination from any real chance at playing in the post season, persevered and with a little help from a couple of rookies and a couple of second year players, pulled out the win off the foot of new kicker Billy Cundiff.
Rookie CB,Lardarius Webb, pressed into starting due to a season ending injury to Fabian Washington last week, almost ended the game with an interception but just couldn't hold onto what would have been a pick-six. Seldom used rookie LB Paul Kruger, who is also getting playing time due to Terrell Suggs' injury, made the totally unexpected interception in OT and ran the ball back deep into Steelers territory. From there, it was just a matter of seconde year QB Joe Flacco handing it to 2nd year RB, Ray Rice, to get the ball into better field position centered for the game winning Cundiff FG.
A lot of fans will say the team looked boring and flat and should have won this game going away. Remember, other than Troy Polamalu, this was the same Pittsburgh defense that shut down the Ravens three times last season and would know they needed to have a solid game to help their offensive issues. Third string QB Dennis Dixon had a great game up until that final interception, passing for one TD and running for another. Overall, the Steelers offense moved the ball pretty well, especially on the ground. One might have thought that the Ravens defense would do whatever it took to shut down the Pittsburgh running game and force Dixon to beat them through the air. However, that didn't happen as the Steelers ran for 153 yards, with 95 from Rashard Mendenhall.
Offensively, the Ravens might have looked boring and inefficient, but they still racked up decent yardage on the ground (132 yards), led by Rice's 88 yards and through the air on Flacco's 23 for 35 for 289 yards and the one TD pass to Derrick Mason(7 receptions for 62 yards). Wide receiver Mark Clayton had one of his best games of his career, catching seven passes for 129 yards, including a great catch off of a long bomb of 54 yards.
All in all, the win keeps us int he playoff hunt and looking at our competition for the post season, we now have the ability to control our own fate. Continuing the progress will require going up to Green Bay to face the Packers next Monday night in what will be the first night game in December in Green Bay history. Why is this? Because it's so damn cold there this time of year, so why do our Ravens get the honor of dealing with those elements? That should be a great game against a very good offense and a Packers team that has played pretty well the last few weeks and are chasing a post season berth themselves. More will follow on the Packers game but for now we can dissect and debate the Ravens win over the Steelers last night, a phrase we haven't uttered for well almost two years now.
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Positive
-Clayton had a great game and it was nice to see him ballin out like that
-Ray Rice as always
-Our secondary stepped it up yesterday and Webb continues to awe me with his improvement each game.
-Flacco had a solid game but needs to get the ball out of his hands a little quicker and not be so quick to resort to the check down.
-Cundif has looked great and that kick attempt at the end of regulation was great for what he was up against and the rush he was in.
-Nice to see Carr last night, do not know where you have been all year but please stay and keep it up.
Needs improvement
-I do not know if Flacco was under so much pressure because he was holding the ball too long or if the o-line was not getting it done
-lets get the pass rush going and start pressuring the quarterback a little more.
-LIMIT THE PENALTIES ESPECIALLY TYREE ON SPECIAL TEAMS.
-Capitalize in the redzone and show a little creativity Cam. Give Rice a toss or something inside the ten and let the man run.
-Clock management….we could of finished the game before overtime if Flacco got the ball off and avoided a sack.
-Be more decisive Harbaugh. We burnt two timeouts last night that were not needed at the time. It should not take that long to make up your mind as to whether or not we are punting, kicking, or going for the forth down.
-I would love to see McClain getting more carries in a jumbo formation and start controlling the clock.
-We need to put our opponents away when we have the chance.
Other than that, I will take the win and move on the Green Bay next week. Very happy with the result. Go Ravens!
I thought Foxworth was lost out there
and wondered why he was on Santonio Holmes when Webb is faster than him. I’d put Fox on Ward and hope he doesn’t go long. Carr was also clueless on defense but his return game stepped up for a change. Flacco holds the ball too long and needs to know where he is and not take such critical sacks.
Inside the forty of the opponents, NEVER punt. Always either go for it or try the field goal. Risk/reward not worth the stupid punt to get us 10-15 yards.
Clayton looked solid but why other than 3rd down throws to K-Wash does the team ignore the middle of the field on passing downs!?
Clear to me that Heap has decent hands but gets into the pattern so slow and can’t do squat with the ball afterwards (no YAC).
Oher is better than Gaither, but without someone to take over RT, Oher has to stay there- for now.
Once again, no pass rush to speak of. While the Packers’ Aaron Rodgrs holds onto the ball too long and his o-line is pretty poor, without challenging him to throw early with pressure, he will kill us with those receivers he has to throw to. Between Driver, Jennings, Jones, and the TE’s, our DB’s heads will be spinning if we don’t get pressure.
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Nov 30, 2009 1:18 PM EST up reply actions
foxworth got seriously owned
but the good news is that Lardarius looks like a starter to me. He got beat by wallace and was lucky that Dixon couldn’t connect with him for the TD, but aside from that he’s been very aggressive and explosive and it helps that he actually makes tackles and sheds blocks. Foxworth gets blocked back by like 10 yards on every running play and Santonio seemed to easily be able to make Fox tangle his legs together whenever he needed to beat him.
I’m not really sure we’re playing playoff-worthy football right now, but the win is good. if nothing else, we will probably be glad that Webb and Kruger got all this playing time when next season comes around. (I know, it’s sad that I’m already talking about next season.)
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
So what is the deal with Flacco's ankle?
The Steelers pash rush was pretty ferocious and there wasn’t much time to react on a number of the sacks. Steelers blitz packages resulted in plenty of confusion. However, Flacco looked like a statue. Preston wrote that he thinks the ankle is worse than the team is letting on, given Flacco’s general lack of mobility. It wouldn’t surprise me.
Roethlisberger would have had success given the lack of pass rush the Ravens generated. Most of the Ravens blitzes were picked up, and they didn’t really rattle Dixon until they realized he couldn’t read the zone coverage. That lack of pass rush again doesn’t bode well against a good QB. It the same old story in the secondary, with Webb at least showing some signs of being aware of what to do on a consistent basis.
Right now, a win is a win.
289 yards throwing and a couple of nice deep balls
says the ankle is good enough and not an excuse.
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Nov 30, 2009 1:50 PM EST up reply actions
he needs to feel that rush coming
and hold on to that damn ball.
He often misses high, or forces receivers to go up high on screen passes. While practice can bring those balls down so that we can actually execute those bubble screens, I also think that adding a real 6’4" receiver would be huge. While Clayton has to go up 30" into the air to grab flacco’s ball and comes down unable to pick up extra yardage, a Julio Jones-type would be able to regain his footing much more quickly and get more YAC.
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Sweet thoughts
a 6’4" receiver for X-mas sounds like a great present. However, he might have to wait for the Easter Bunny (NFL Draft) to bring him one!
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Nov 30, 2009 4:57 PM EST up reply actions
Keep dreaming
Cause we will never go after an elite WR. Not Ozzie’s style.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
we've tried to before and we will try to again
Julio might not come out this year anyway. no point in taking a WR first round if he isn’t our type (i.e., golden tate), but if there’s a stud there at WR ozzie will take him.
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Still think Marshall will be there after this year
Maybe even Boldin, but Marshall is more ideal.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
I think everyobne has seen
how much better Marshall makes his QB look. For proof, see both Orton (with him) and Cutler (without)!
aka 'Rexx'
yeah Marshall is definitely the better of the two
plus he’s younger.
but i’d still rather draft a guy… I don’t see Denver trading away the main reason their QB looks good.
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Yes yes and YES!
Should have signed him before this season even started.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
This was not the same Steelers D as last year
The Ravens played well, but they should have. The Steelers no longer have Bryant McFadden or Larry Foote. Pro Bowl players Troy Polamalu and Aaron Smith were out with injuries. James Farrior looks like he’s really feeling the effects of old age. Still, a win is a win.
by CarlWeathersMustache on Nov 30, 2009 1:34 PM EST reply actions
Same could be said of the Ravens defense
so then what’s the point?
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Nov 30, 2009 1:50 PM EST up reply actions
Young guns showed potential for bright future
We’re all gonna hear it from our favorite Steelers fan, excuses and what-ifs regarding Roethlisburger and Polamalu sitting out. The truth is that coming down the stretch, good teams can either stay healthy or the back-ups can step up and make plays. Dixon deserves credit for not making mistakes and their defense lacks the game-changing performer without 43. When it came down to it, the Ravens back-ups stepped up. Lardar flew around the field and played the role of a shut-down corner, proving what many people have been saying for weeks that he deserves the starting spot. The kid is a beast. Paul Kruger came up huge and basically won the game for us. Long story short, when you play an NFL team you’re playing against the entire team, not just the big name guys. Depth is crucial and our boys proved that we are the deeper team. Chalk it up, let’s ride this through the rest of the season and snag that wildcard. RAVENS BABY!
by Purple_Prowler on Nov 30, 2009 1:48 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I hear that
I’ve noticed that we use a TON of personell substitutions in our front seven this year, which I think will be beneficial in the long run (even if we saw a lot of growing pains initially).
Steelers fans have the right to be frustrated, but lets be honest, keeping Ben out of this game was not only smart but obviously necessary. This guy is approaching Steve Young status in the number of concussions he’s had, and at his age you really need to protect him from himself and take the long view. The Steelers just won a SB with him and they can win more assuming he doesn’t get dain bramage. Playing him yesterday could have been incredibly dangerous.
I like Gooddell’s idea of having a mandatory 7-day inactive period following all concussions so that guys don’t have the option of “playing it tough” and risking their mental health. I would say the exact same thing if it was Flacco’s concussion and the shoe was on the other foot.
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
by jackmca on Nov 30, 2009 1:59 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Hines Ward
What an a-hole throwing his teammate under the bus like that. I guess winning is more important than his teammates health.
No-one expects Hines Ward to act with class… ever.
by math_geek on Nov 30, 2009 2:54 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
On 1370...
pretty much the last 15 minutes of the broadcast has been Ward’s post game interview. I love how he says something like “He could have stayed out…or looked at the big picture and played”….um no Hines…that isn’t the big picture.
Football players need to be educated about the dangers. I got about 4 or five of them when I was in the military (mechanic on a boat…lots of chances to hit your head). I never really though about it till I had a seizure while driving a few years down the road. Within six months, I’m on seizure meds, getting terrible migraines…all kinds of shit I never had a problem with before.
I don’t think Hines is really throwing Ben under the bus or being out of line on concussions….he is just showing his ignorance. An ignorance that is much too pervasive throughout the league, that someone can receive a brain injury and just bounce back like its a stinger.
"The ball always seems to find Ed Reed...The man is a menace"
by UMBC Oriole fan on Nov 30, 2009 4:13 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Ward was indeed ignorant on that interview
and his atttempt to back track on the one today was just as bad. He said that players don’t think or their futures when deciding whether or not to play on Sundays. Perhaps idiots like him don’t but Ben and Kurt Warner and now perhaps others will start doing the same.
No offense to Magic Johnson, but when he announced he was HIV Positive, it was the biggest boost to the public’s awareness of AIDS than anyone could have ever hoped for in the fight against that disease.
Now, both Ben’s and Kurt’s missing key games has taken the issue of concussions from the small talk to the huge issue that it is. Perhaps the older guys who are suffering will now get their disability benefits that they so deserve.
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Nov 30, 2009 5:02 PM EST up reply actions
couldn't agree more.
the REAL “big picture” for Ben and Tomlin is that they JUST won a superbowl and will have many more chances to do so, even if they miss the playoffs this year. If they were to have played Ben and allowed him to get another concussion, those chances could have been dashed last night. It is a simple, obvious decision to bench him.
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
People seem to really forget...
but Troy Aikman’s career was drastically cut short by concussions. Hell, he has gone on record saying he didn’t remember Superbowl XXVIII at all despite winning the damn thing. He only got to play 11 years before his injuries added up. 11 sounds like a long time, but this was a guy that was still playing well, but he couldn’t risk another hit. If Troy couldn’t get people to give a shit about concussions, I don’t know what it will take.
"The ball always seems to find Ed Reed...The man is a menace"
by UMBC Oriole fan on Nov 30, 2009 5:20 PM EST up reply actions
i hope goodell gets his new rule
mandatory 7-day inactive period for all concussions. Very very good idea. It takes machismo out of the equation and doesn’t allow players to act like they’re fine.
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Steelers Fan here
That was a great game, even though I was frustrated we were letting Dixon throw in OT when it was obvious he was lost against the Ravens zone.
Congrats to you guys, Rice looked great! I am glad we did not play Ben, we still have a few (should be) easy games and I believe our game against you guys in Pittsburgh will be the more important of our two games. Hopefully, with rest, we can get Ben and Troy back, and lets not forget Chris Kemoeatu (Foster looked fat and slow).
Hopefully we win our games, you win yours, and we settle it in Pittsburgh! Hopefully the victor gets a first round playoff date with the Bengals!
I give props to Cundiff
not just for the game-winner, but the 56-yarder that he missed. Honestly, he missed short, but he ran out there with the clock expiring, got the ball off, and kicked it as hard as he could with pretty much perfect curve on the ball. If he HAD been within his range (thanks Clayton), that ball would have been good and we wouldn’t have needed an OT to settle things.
His career numbers might not be consistent, but Cundiff just showed that he doesn’t blink in the clutch. I’m glad to keep this guy for now.
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
by jackmca on Nov 30, 2009 1:54 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Stover
Missed one in the Colt game yesterday.
Before Cundiff kicked it they said he felt good up to 53 so he was right on.
by section117 on Nov 30, 2009 2:33 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
But if he made it
All hell would have broken loose throughout the league with the blown forward fumble call that the refs didn’t make. Man, it would be like 2012 today for Steeler fans if that FG went in.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
yeah its almost a blessing
that we averted that controversy. we won fair and square.
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
we've already had plenty to whine about
waaaa waaaa waaaa, 6-5, waaaaa no troy waaaaaa, no smith waaaaa, no ben waaaaa for bmore, BA is a tool waaaaaaaa……………
hope you loved it
Don't go blaming Clayton
He made some great grabs that helped put us in position to win. Blame Flacco for not getting rid of the ball and taking the stupid sack that led to that longer FG.
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Nov 30, 2009 5:03 PM EST up reply actions
I blame Clayton for the very very stupid Pass Interference penalty which dropped us back ten yards. We would have been able to press forward for another 5 or 10 yards and Cundiff would have ended the game in regulation.
I also blame Flacco for his two fumbles, as he NEEDS to learn how to feel that rush and grip that ball like its his only child, but I don’t even think we would have been passing in that situation if Clayton hadn’t set the pick that brought the PI penalty.
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
I'm a happy camper!!
A win is a win is a win! Don’t matter how you got there, it’s A WIN!! Now I’m hoping for a win Monday 12/7 as I am hosting a dinner with 5 Packer fans.
I liked the post-game interview “Ray & Ray—Double Trouble” lol
Lonely Ravens fan in Cheese Head country (Watertown, WI)
my thoughts
Lardarius’ play on Wallace in the endzone was awesome. Even though beat, Lardar timed his disruption perfectly, what a steal in the third round!
Fox still leads the team in passes defended and it’s his first year in the defense, he’ll come around.
Landry looked good too.
Good to see McClain on a couple of carries. It’s awesome watching people try to tackle him. It’d be great if he got more into the rotation.
It’s good to see Flacco spreading the ball around instead of dump passes to Ray Rice. Hello Mark Clayton!
As is the consensus of this forum Im sure we all want to ask Harbaugh WHERE IS THE PASS RUSH?!?! The Steeler’s line, for how much criticism they have received, looked elite against chris and al’s “vaunted baltimore defense.”
Sizzle is out but it’s no excuse. It seems the only one working on the blitz out there is Ray Ray. The motor on the team is gone. We need to draft a big 6’6 athletic freak to play OLB or DE who presses play after play. Johnson and Edwards were just getting run out of the play every time.
Mattison has a lot of talent. He tweaks great in the 2nd half but after last night im sick to my stomach what a 2nd year quarterback did to us. No excuses on this one. His blitzes are lame and aren’t generating any pressure. We are not as stout on the run anymore and I am sure everyone else in the forum is sick of seeing backs chew up 6-7 yards a carry.
This should of been an easy game for us with Worthlessburger out. I know our team has the talent and grit but either we are that bad or the Steelers are that good. I don’t know which one to believe.
You know why Foxworth leads us in passes defended?
Everyone throws at his direction because they know how weak he has played!
Years ago, the Orioles had an OF named Joe Orsulak who led the majors in outfield assists. Was he so good an outfielder? No, everyone ran on his weak arm so he was always throwing to the plate and the numbers added up, but the percentages were still horrible.
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Nov 30, 2009 5:05 PM EST up reply actions
right you are
but i think we’ve been spoiled by the jared allen’s of the league who thrive their first years in the defense. Aside from his injury, Antwan odom is a good example of someone that thrives after their first year in a defense. I didn’t say his play was stellar I’m just saying give him time.
the lack of a pass rush
also doesnt help him either
Foxworth looked terrible last night
and it wasn’t the first time. Most troublesome to me is how easily WRs block him on running plays. He is just not physically aggressive. Notice how he had to spin Santonio Holmes around twice just to tackle him? That’s just weak. If he has to do that to Donald Driver, consider the tackle broken.
Bruce is exactly right about why he leads us in passes defended. I have seen him improve and regress over the course of the season, but at this point I think Webb is already better than him.
Landry has looked much better recently. While he looked timid (and understandably so) in the opening games of the season, I saw him cleaning clocks last night and flexing his muscles after big hits. That lets me know that he’s back in his groove and confident in his ability to deal hits. With him and Webb, our secondary could be very good in a few years.
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Whenever I see Landry
matched up one on one with a wideout, I get real nervous.
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Nov 30, 2009 8:03 PM EST up reply actions
sure, i don't want him doing that.
but he can fly to the ball and he’s not too shabby in zone coverage, so he’s a starter at SS in my book. Plus he can hit.
"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden
Yes, can hit and tackle
and even intercept poorly thrown balls, but cover? Nope. However, I’ll take him…for now.
aka 'Rexx'
I enjoyed last night's game. Many contributions on each side of the ball were seen during
that game. I’m not going to complain about anything. I’ll just saver the victory and move on to the next game.
However, I do think the Ravens should use all of their weapons on offense such as Williams, Washington, and LJ Smith. Hopefully, McClain is OK after hurting his back during the game.
LJ and D-Will were in there a few times, but never targeted
Other than Mason, Rice and Clayton, no one gets looks except K-Wash on 3rd downs.
aka 'Rexx'
by Bruce Raffel on Nov 30, 2009 8:04 PM EST up reply actions
Great game
As a Steelers fan I’m not happy about the loss, but it was one of the most enjoyable regular season games I’ve ever witnessed. Both teams played hard, physical but clean football. It proved ultimately it’s the best rivalry in the NFL. Baltimore deserved the win, congratulations.
We’ll cya in Pittsburgh!
Well, I changed my mind. I need to complain about Dominique Foxworth. I think he should
be demoted to the #2 corner with Webb ascending to the #1 corner, even though he probably isn’t ready. Foxworth just isn’t that good. He seems to have stiff hips and not ideal quickness to play the cornerback spot. Webb should be the #1 corner by default. The sad part is the depth at that position. Yikes!
One last post, speaking on the secondary depth, I like Cary Williams and Tony Carter. Both
Players are on practice squads but I think they are hidden gems, especially Tony Carter, though he is a lightweight.
That play was classic CMac
Even as Moss was already getting behind him, McAlister was staring into the backfield as if watching Tom Brady sail the ball over his head and into Moss’ arms was going to help things. A couple plays before that, he broke up a pass but Jaws suggested that he got away with an armbar.
"The United States is the New York Yankees of countries...powerful and respected until the year 2000." - Homer J. Simpson
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